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WebCite/supporters

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This is an archived version of this page, as edited by Giants2008 (talk | contribs) at 02:18, 18 February 2013 (→People interested: Supporting (ec)). It may differ significantly from the current version .

People interested

  1. I've already donated, but yes, we need this. I've used it at least 1500 times in my writing Crisco 1492 (talk)
  2. The proposal, initiated here, has my full support. I believe WMF should consider a cooperation with WebCite and support them with part of the WMF funds. In relation to this, the Spending section citing a criticism of money being spent on things that may be valid, such as photos of pop concerts at the German Chapter's wikimedia project, but should be lower on the WMF's priority list in comparison to such things as prevention of link rot, was also added by me to the English WP article on The Foundation, but was removed by editor The ed17 here altogether. --DancingPhilosopher (talk) 16:43, 9 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  3. I absolutely support this, and I use the service all the time. There have been various proposals in the past that WMF start up their own online citation archive service in case sites like this disappear, but they haven't really gone anywhere. As this one is already very well established, I think this would be an excellent usage of WMF funds as this site supports our efforts to create an excellent encyclopedia. It would also be very useful to have a bot which crawled all citations in all articles and archived them automatically, then added the link to the archived reference. This would make all the online citations better and easily checked even if the original source died. ···日本穣 ? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe 18:51, 9 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  4. I see this as a win win thing, I have seen lots and lots of links lost due to linkrot. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 19:02, 9 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  5. Not only is it a good idea, but EVERY external link should be converted to WebCite. Who knows when a site will go down?Little green rosetta (talk) 20:31, 9 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  6. I agree with the others. WebCite's fundraising goal is US50,000ドル. The closing date is "end of 2013", but whether that means December 31 is unknown. The fact that we are notified this early is a good sign that we have some time to work with them. Arsonal (talk) 21:07, 9 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  7. If the WMF has the money to spare, I could think of nothing better to do with it than to purchase a web-archiving service. Goodraise (talk) 03:24, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  8. If the WMF can actually afford to do this, it would be great. ZX95 (talk) 04:33, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  9. An excellent idea. I too use WebCite a lot. But I also make much use of WebCite for purposes utterly unrelated to Wikipedia/WMF, and so, I venture to guess, do a large percentage of the people who have added or will add their names to this list. I therefore had both Wikipedia and business/personal reasons to throw some change into WebCite's hat. This was 20 hours ago (Fundrazr tells me), and I'm disappointed to note that since then only three people (from anywhere) have done the same. Personally donating to WebCite's appeal is in no way incompatible with asking WMF to offer to take over WebCite; indeed, it helps, because the more shallowly WebCite is in the red, the less money WMF would have to spend on bringing it up to speed. So yes, what Goodraise says. But also, please cough up, you (individual) people, and quickly. -- Hoary Returns (talk) 04:52, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  10. Much needed. The foundation will greatly benefit from this. — ΛΧΣ 21 06:20, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  11. Doing something, anything, to save WebCite is important for Wikipedia and the internets as a whole.--GrapedApe (talk) 16:29, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  12. Supporting, but noting that it is not necessary that WebCite is going dark after 2013, only that they won't accept links post 2013 if they don't get funded. But still, the idea of losing this service in the future is of concern givne much of our web page reliance and the difficulties with assuring archive.org backups. --Masem (talk) 18:00, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  13. Support. This would be a valuable asset. Fredlyfish4 (talk) 18:31, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  14. This is pretty much necessary if we've going to maintain the security of a number of references for articles. Not to mention that the lack of WebCite would be detrimental for quite a few places on the internet. Silver seren (talk) 20:07, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  15. Agreed with Goodraise. Archived sources is the foundation that support my contributions to Wikipedia; I have lost too many once-verifiable pieces of information when I started out editing. It only makes sense that WMF would have a hand in keeping sources verifiable, preferably for as long as WMF and Wikipedia exist. I have always wondered about what would happen if I lost WebCite, but it never occurred to me to make the project a part of WMF. Keraunoscopia (talk) 20:49, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  16. I'm not sure WMF can take over WebCitation (and does the owner really even want to be taken over); besides, it has a significant reason for existing outside our own uses. That said, the WMF fronting them money to continue operation does help all Wikimedia projects. David Fuchs (talk) 21:11, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  17. Not sure about feasibility of taking over but wholehearted support for doing whatever we can to help. WebCite archive links are not just used in many thousands of article to save information from failing verification, but I would hazard that a high percentage of that use is in high quality articles for various reasons (at w:WP:FAC, for example, it is common to ask nominators to provide archived links for all web only citations). Even if we can't take over or save WebCite, the WMF should seriously consider starting its own similar service. Sourcing and what it is used for—verification, notability, determining OR, NPOV, etc.—is the keystone of the encyclopedia projects (and some others, e.g., attestation at Wiktionary), and the projects are still young. Taking a long view, most web-only sources will go dead while we (I hope) endure. It's not how many links will go dead this year, but how many over the next thirty years. We will continue to use web-only sources and if we don't have a stable platform and one we control to ensure they remain viable, the problem of link rot can only compound, with almost all links being dead eventually.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:29, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  18. I think this would be a great idea! ·Add§hore· Talk To Me! 22:35, 10 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  19. Being able to validate free content with reference to non-free sources is essential and will be maintained/furthered by this proposal. While the WMF is all about doing this through a free-only mindset, using a non-free feature like WebCite to support the creation of free knowledge fits comfortably within my views. MBisanz talk 01:16, 11 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  20. Support, while still noting David's concerns. --Rs chen 7754 01:17, 11 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  21. Support:Had a thought of something similar recently. -- ɑηsuмaη ʈ ᶏ ɭ Ϟ 06:00, 11 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  22. Support:WebCite has been an invaluable resource in protecting claims made through long, hard research on a variety of topics and would be a critical loss for all Wikipedias if it were to no longer be available. Axem Titanium (talk) 23:37, 11 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  23. Of any of the new project ideas that have come along, this is one that flat out is not just useful but downright essential to the mission of the Wikimedia Foundation. I'd agree that it shouldn't be a replacement to WebCite or Archive.org, but this has become a significant issue on the various Wikimedia projects where long term citations on many sources are desperately needed for critical pages. --Roberth (talk) 00:33, 12 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  24. Strong support - The ability to preserve critical source material is of paramount importance for the fulfillment of our mission. — C M B J 13:37, 12 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  25. Strong support - I've used WebCite in my Wikipedia edits. It's also useful in academia and elsewhere. This is a critical resource that really needs to be preserved. I would be happy to help save WebCite however I can. Tucoxn (talk) 20:44, 12 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  26. Weak support for takeover (not my first choice, but if other options don't materialise, okay); I would have thought some form of merger with en:Internet Archive would make more sense. Strong support for WMF-WebCite collaboration to ensure the continued survival and development of WebCite, including WMF providing resources to WebCite. Rd232 (talk) 23:50, 12 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  27. Support—this is exactly the type of things that the WMF should be investing its funds in. At least, this is the kind of activity I would like to see when I donate, for what it's worth. This has a direct long-term benefit both for Wikipedia and for the free content movement as a whole. —Ynhockey (talk) 09:46, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  28. Support and what User:Fuhghettaboutit said. I'm not sure WebCite wants to be taken control over, but a collaboration is the future way to go. (I started using the WebCite servive for WP articles a year ago.) Sgeureka (talk) 14:19, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  29. Support, at least based on an initial reading. Would be worth exploring what the Internet Archive is doing with the Wayback Machine as well. -Pete F (talk) 15:00, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  30. support, internet archive better fit, but if they won't. Slowking4 (talk) 15:01, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  31. Support take over if possible. If not, is there any open-source archival tool that WMF could use to implement such a service? Automatic backup of all references is a must. Link rot is a terrible problem for verifiability. By the way, should WebCite change hands, current archived links not referenced by Wikimedia projects would probably best be exported to some other service (e.g. http://archive.is) and removed from Wikimedia-WebCite. --Waldir (talk) 15:41, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  32. Support Wikimedia supporting an open-source archival tool. Ideally WebCite would become that. Mike Linksvayer (talk) 17:51, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  33. Support Any WMF action that will keep access to this service running. I have zero preference as to how that is done as long as the WMF is willing.Ryan Vesey (talk) 19:59, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  34. Support Support It certainly makes sense to take this as an opportunity to reconsider how we approach link rot. I would be in favour of any solution that would result in all external links from Wikimedia projects being archived automatically (allowing for a day or so to clean out spam links, and accounting for policies of sites that would forbid such archiving) in a system that uses open-source software and has a viable longterm-preservation strategy. It would be nice to do that with WebCite, since this has mostly worked fine on the Wikimedia end (e.g. the Russian Wikipedia). -- Daniel Mietchen - WiR/OS (talk) 23:44, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  35. Comment It beats me why Wikipedia doesn't just offer its own archiving service. Surely it would be cheaper for the foundation to buy a few servers to host Wikipedia citations rather than funding a service that hosts far more web pages than Wikipedia itself uses. Betty Logan (talk) 23:19, 13 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  36. Comment Archiving on WMF's own servers makes more sense. Harsh (talk) 13:29, 14 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  37. Support For usage with external links on the wiki. Ideally, the WMF should have a bot that auto-archives links as they are added. This shouldn't be a major technical hurdle.Smallman12q (talk) 03:11, 15 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  38. Undoubtedly yes. WPTC relies heavily on this for archived government advisories Hurricanefan24 (talk) 21:14, 15 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  39. Support - Anything that the WMF can do to make our projects more reliable and more easily verified should be done without hesitation. While I'm not convinced that a WMF takeover of WebCite is in the offing, anything that can be done to help ought to be done.Evanh2008 (talk) 00:53, 16 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  40. Support - this service is very much needed if we want to keep information freely available as source of Wikipedia articles. Romaine (talk) 11:33, 16 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  41. WMF should do whatever it can. WP really depends on WebCite. I donated, and created a donation-encouraging userbox at w:en:User:UBX/WebCite2. — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 11:57, 16 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  42. Comment Webcite needs to be supported. If Webcite is unable to raise the money, then WMF should provide the support or take over the work. I have donated a small amount, and I urge Wikipedians to do the same. WVhybrid (talk) 06:07, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  43. Support Sure, why not. I am yet to figure out a probable adversarial outcome should this proposal be implemented. Michael (talk) 07:06, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  44. Support. Growing our mission is good, archival is a natural extension. Assuming, of course, it's feasible. --HectorMoffet (talk) 07:23, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  45. Support. Link rot is one of our biggest problems, and would be insurmountable without archives. Takeover is best, if possible, because it would raise the possibility of creating tools without fear that they could be undermined by interface changes. --Stfg (talk) 13:09, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  46. Support An essential tool for Wikipedia --Ita140188 (talk) 13:46, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  47. Strong Support - Yes, WebCite Seems A Worthy Service For Wikipedia - Enjoy! :) Drbogdan (talk) 15:18, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  48. Support on the basis that mw:Extension:ArchiveLinks and the agreements with archive.org are reviewed to discern whether this is an appropriate and valuable usage of WMF funding. Sillyfolkboy (talk) 16:29, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  49. Support Absolutely needed. Armbrust (talk) 16:32, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  50. Support --LlamaAl (talk) 16:35, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  51. Support the WMF doing whatever is necessary to keep WebCite in business. It has become too important to lose. SpinningSpark 17:21, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  52. Oppose for the time being. This is a poor business case. What are the projected cost over the long and short term? What is the predicted revenue stream. If it is a bailout can the Foundation afford it? If funding is available, should it not be spent on existing projects? The Foundation income is mainly from fundraising and it seems unethical and possibly illegal to spend money on projects that were not named in the annual appeals. But I would not object to separate fundraising banners across the projects. GrahamColm (talk) 20:36, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  53. Support. Linkrot is a nagging problem, insufficiently covered by archive.org's Wayback Machine and Google's cache function. Wikipedia needs this service. Binksternet (talk) 20:49, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  54. Oppose I do not believe taking over the site is a good way of doing things. Surely the Foundation can marshal some support for getting WebCite's 50,000,ドル which is paltry in terms of what a little determined promotion can generate.--The Devil's Advocate (talk) 21:35, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  55. Support Link rot is a huge problem for Wikipedia and WebCite is so far the most efficient solution to the problem. If WebCite is having financial problems this year, they are bound to have it two years down the road. Of course, WMF can pay some money to get it out of the current squeeze, but perhaps WMF also can provide an organizational and technical framework which would secure the future development of WebCite. Arsenikk (talk) 22:19, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  56. Strong Support Support Link rot is a huge problem not only for Wikipedia. --Morten Haan (talk) 23:23, 17 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  57. Strong Support Support I use WebCite for nearly all my links. Mtminchi08 (talk) 00:05, 18 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  58. Support -- It's hard to have reliable references when Web Pages die. Greengreengreenred (talk) 02:15, 18 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  59. Support the foundation providing WebCite the money it needs to continue operating. As someone who has donated to WMF, I want the foundation to spend money on things that benefit the projects. While I don't think every single link has to be archived through WebCite, the site is very useful for ensuring that pages from unstable websites can be preserved as viable sources even after going dead. This provides great value for the English Wikipedia at least, and I imagine other languages' Wikipedias have also been aided. For an organization that raised 25ドル million in 2012, I don't think 50,000ドル is asking too much for a proposal that will help us preserve our content. If we can fund a project that will save quality content from being delisted in the future, I strongly suggest that we do so. I'm sure other people who donated will understand the rationale behind this use of funds. Giants2008 (talk) 02:18, 18 February 2013 (UTC) [reply ]
  60. Support Obviously.

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