User talk:GerardM

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For earlier stuff check the user:GerardM/archive

Can you take look at this [1]. Thanks. --Seha 16:13, 3 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hello GerardM, just wanted to let You know, that the IP You blocked for one month is highly dynamic [2]. :(

Best regards, --birdy geimfyglið _{(:> )=|} 17:18, 3 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Please, add the notices about betawiki on ca.wiki at ca:Viquipèdia:La taverna/Arxius/Novetats/Recent as it is indicated in the internal distribution list. --Vriullop 13:06, 10 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Nobody informed our comity that this list existed. Thanks, GerardM 16:28, 10 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hello GerardM Please; show the way to Approval process. I Also support this action and that it is a need in Bakhtiari society. It is only you who could help me. OS. Unless you help me;it deleted.Thanks [[3]]--Behdarvandyani 17:07, 18 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi Gerard

Would you mind Having a look at this ,and give me you openion ; what is written there is important but is shipmaster a representative of the subcommitee. I am happy to answer but I am not sure what the question is . Many thanks.--Ghaly 20:16, 24 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi, Gerard. Please review Language subcommittee/Status/wv/ar. --Meno25 14:16, 28 January 2009 (UTC) Reply

Sorry. Thanks. Mikhailov Kusserow (talk) 04:20, 25 February 2009 (UTC) Reply

Ik wil je niet vervelend doen of je iets verplichten, maar je overlegpagina begint wel erg groot en onlaadbaar te worden :( --OosWesThoesBes 10:38, 25 February 2009 (UTC) Reply

<grijns> nu moet je zoeken in een nog steeds wel erg groot archief :) </grijns> GerardM 11:54, 26 February 2009 (UTC) Reply

Gelukkig dan dat ik daar niet hoef te komen :) --OosWesThoesBes 13:31, 26 February 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi, Gerard. Currently, there are 2 requests for wikis in Mirandese: a Wikipedia and a Wiktionary. I noticed that the requirements for the Wiktionary already contain full localization as if it were a second project. From my perception, it seems that the Wiktionary is more demanded right now, while the Wikipedia is kind of "abandoned". As these two are still requests, wouldn't it be more correct to require just the Most Used messages for the first approved project (which may be the Wiktionary)? I think the Wiktionary proposer thinks Most Used suffices, which would make sense if the Wiktionary gets approved before the Wikipedia. Cheers, Malafaya 11:57, 2 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

When the "most used messages" have bee localised, it is fine when a request is made to have Wiktionary first. At that time full localisation will be required before a Wikipedia may be started. It is not really an issue, just get it done. Thanks, GerardM 12:40, 2 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

That's what I thought. Thanks, Malafaya 13:34, 2 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Could you please update Requests for new languages/Wiktionary Mirandese to eligible? :) Malafaya 13:40, 2 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Saluton, Gerard. Please, help us fix the namespaces issue at os.wiki: it seems that we use Википеди: there, which is not the namespace for Wikipedia:. Could you please check that? That will make the article count fall, I presume, but the thing must be done. And I do not know how to do it the right way; hopefully you can help. Thank you in advance, Amikeco 03:18, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hoi, these issues are dealt with at translatewiki.net. The name of namespaces is however something that is true for Ossetian. When it is only true for Wikipedia, it becomes a different story. GerardM 11:43, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

The namespace Wikipedia: — how could we change it to the de facto used (but supposedly counted as main space articles) Википеди: — that is the question. — Amikeco 12:27, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

This too is best asked at Translatewiki.net ... Thanks, GerardM 13:53, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

The change of project namespace name (Wikipedia, Wiktionary, etc.) should be requested at bugzilla:. Other namespaces names can be translated at translatewiki.net. Malafaya 16:26, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Now it's fixed. Thank you all. Amikeco 11:11, 8 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Would you please help us again? We have this problem: bots are doing their best to fix double redirects, but they are wrong using the Ossetic translation from betawiki („рарвыст" for „redirect"). How could we push the translation from betawiki into use? Amikeco 00:53, 30 May 2009 (UTC) Reply

The best place to ask is at Support at translatewiki.net. Thanks, GerardM 04:21, 30 May 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi GerardM. I wanted to know if this page could be updated status of the Mirandese. I'm not sure but Mirandese Wikipedia could already be aproved? Could that process start? Thank you --Cecílio 08:39, 6 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hoi, either the Mirandese Wikipedia or the Mirandese Wiktionary may start with only the most used messages localised. We have had a request to give preference to Wiktionary. This request is admissable. There are other criteria for starting a new project then just the localisation.

It is to be preferred when the Mirandese community agrees on what gets preference. When there is no agreement, the project that is the most vibrant will go first. Thanks, GerardM 09:34, 6 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Thanks for the quick reply. Mirandese Wikipedia should go first(i talked with the user that said that Wiktionary is the first project and explained the situation). Mirandese Wikipedia it's older and has more contents and active users. I just requested the Wiktionary because i think that the Wikipedia can be approved. Most used messages are already done. You can see here Untranslated Most used Messages. So could be started the approve process for Mirandese Wikipedia? Once again thank you - Cecílio 09:49, 6 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

When there is a consensus, that is great. I am sure that we will know that there is consensus when we assess the Mirandese projects. In the end, it is the people that do that have the biggest say in this. Thanks, GerardM 11:04, 6 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hallo GerardM,

Wij hebben besloten om de Wikinuujs voorrang te geven tegen de Wikibeuk. Ik zeg het je hierbij zodat je het begrijpt en het kunt weten. Mogen we ooit door de dingetje (en: interface) klaarkomen dan weet je dat je je moet richten op de aktiviteit van wn/li. Beetje wazig allemaal, maar je bent slim genoeg om het te begrijpen :) --OosWesThoesBes 15:44, 24 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hello, Translations of All MediaWiki messages and all extensions used by wikimedia are completed. Could you please update?Srhat 16:11, 26 March 2009 (UTC) Reply

Could you please take a look at my request about Mari Wikipedia, and post an answer on it? — The preceding unsigned comment was added by Сай (talk) diff, --Mardetanha ^talk 16:25, 14 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

In the process for approval of a Kurdish (Soranî) WP (code:ckb) we are at the incubator stage. However, there are more than 500 Sorani pages in the Kurdish Wikipedia (ku) already which would be moved to the new WP and deleted in ku. Is it therefore really necessary to move them all manually to the incubator? --Erdal Ronahi 08:20, 15 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

You have said here that "We do not accept requests for particular orthographies GerardM 16:04, 10 May 2008 (UTC)". So, if we want to write in that orhography, can we do it in the Galician Wikipedia? In Galician Wikipedia should be accepted the AGAL orthography ? Thanks. --Norrin strange 09:34, 16 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hoi, it is for you to convince the Galician Wikipedia that they accept the orthography you support. You have to appreciate that competing orthographies that fight each other are in many way not the best way to promote your language. GerardM 10:10, 16 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

All the worries have been settled out. Why still no progress of this project? --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) 12:36, 21 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi there. I want to ask you to approve the Mirandese Wikipedia. You already meet the criteria for Approval. Thank you. --Cecílio 05:54, 30 April 2009 (UTC) Reply

Please, take a look at Talk:Language_committee#Requests for approval Meadow Mari Wikipedia. Nobody has answered yet on my last post week ago. --Сай 09:00, 20 May 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi there! I am glad to inform you, Language committee, that now Mari Wikipedia Incubator commutity has three active not-grayed out editors for last three monthes (look at statistics). So, the last requirement is meet now.

Also I want to add, that there will be a big conference in July, 10. There would be around 150 young mari. I will take part in this conference and intend to talk about Mari Wikipedia to involve more people to contribute. There are more chances that new participants will contribute to Wikipedia than to Incubator. So, I am asking you to consider approval of Mari Wikipedia before the start of conference(before July, 10). As for me, I have some technical skills. I can help you, for example in creating subdomain mhr.wikipedia.org or in moving pages, etc. And of cource, if you think that mari wikipedia don't have something for final approval, please, write it here immediatly, so we can fix and solve all the problems before July 10.

Please, post your answer here --Сай 05:56, 11 June 2009 (UTC) Reply

Requests for new languages/Wikinews Korean

How to open?

How to translate?

Open it quickly, please~ :) -- WonRyong 23:42, 2 June 2009 (UTC) Reply

--George Mel 13:55, 18 June 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi Gerard, may we know how is the status for Acehnese Wikipedia now? Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 17:02, 20 June 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hello Gerard, we want to make Acehnese Wikipedia could be edited only by registered user. Can you help us please? Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 04:05, 21 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

How about making Acehnese Wikipedia could be edited only by registered user? Si Gam Acèh 03:18, 22 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Do you know why our logo request is not fulfilled until now? Please see: this and this. Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 04:51, 21 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

I have added bug 21213 to bugzilla... Thanks, GerardM 06:19, 21 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Gerard, I invite you to answer a set of questions for the Wikipedia Signpost about your board candidacy: w:Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2009 Board elections/Gerard Meijssen. If you choose to do so, please let me know. I also encourage you to respond by 26 July; interviews with all candidates who respond will be publicized in the 27 July issue of the Signpost.

Faithfully, Ragesoss 21:13, 23 July 2009 (UTC) Reply

So sorry. I fixed the linked.--Ragesoss 21:56, 23 July 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hoi, it has been pointed out to me that my statement was too big. It turned out to be some 1398 characters. I did not know because MediaWiki does not tell you that. As I was told that the officials might remove my statement, I did some surgery on the text.

The only regret I have is that people need to know that GLAM or galleries libraries archives and museums.. They are many characters.. GerardM 13:23, 24 July 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi Gerard, I believe to have fixed a typo in your candidacy statement. --Purodha Blissenbach 11:18, 27 July 2009 (UTC) Reply

Thanks, GerardM 11:43, 27 July 2009 (UTC) Reply

It says your duties affect how fundraising is done. With far less content in the English language wikipedia, which is the largest of them, there are far less people coming here, to look for things enjoyable to read. The mass destruction of a considerable number of articles, after a very small number of people managed to change the notability rules, I think would concern any board set up for the foundation. Someone asked a question about regulating sexual content, so I don't see how that is any different than regulating what else people can keep or destroy. Do you agree that the more people who come to wikipedia, the more donations there would be, and the better off it is? That the massive amounts of destruction, by elitists deletionists who consider everything fancruft and unnecessary, hurts the wikipedia? I mean, when you find an article on a bestselling novel you looked up information on deleted, wouldn't that give you a negative opinion of wikipedia? Dream Focus 17:39, 8 August 2009 (UTC) Reply

The more mature projects are not waiting for directions from the board and, by and large, this should not be necessary. With a project of sufficient size, these things will be taken care off one way or another.

In my opinion there are other things that are more important particularly making sure that the support each and every language gets is sufficient to have viable projects. This is imho vastly more important. The fact that right to left support for languages like Arabic are no properly implemented or that the font used for Lingala is not working well. I think the board is also better positioned to stimulate cooperation with like minded organisations.

It is also important to grow our smaller projects so that they can have the same problems the English Wikipedia has.. The same problems and the same success. Thanks, GerardM 12:25, 9 August 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hello Gerard, will you be so kind to update this page?Regards,--George Mel 10:57, 14 August 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hey Gerard, changes to the project portals should be done on the /temp (ie. Www.wikipedia.org template/temp) pages first and then sync'ed. This makes sure the two pages are up-to-date and changes can be tested first on the temp page (especially when non-admins need to change something). Cbrown1023 talk 21:02, 8 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

That is nice and non obvious. What is obvious is that there are problems with the implememtation of language codes.. this has been mentioned in a bug in bugzilla. GerardM 05:53, 9 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Regarding the content of the Public_speakers page, absent a process to evaluate actual speaking engagements or the like, which I invite you to help work on at the talk page, anyone who wants to put themselves forward as a speaker should be allowed to do so without interference, within reason. This edit could be construed as a personal attack. Please don't do that, and don't edit war with others, no matter how much you may think they are not here in the best interests of the project. ++Lar: t/c 22:48, 17 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Also, are you really prepared to say that the contributions of everyone else on that list are universally welcomed within the WMF community? That's an awfully big word. —Random832 23:10, 17 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Please unblock the IP you were in a dispute with. It's obviously not Kohs, it's based in Great Britain. This kind of behaviour – for an admin – is very poor. Majorly talk 00:51, 18 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

• The comment that Lar points out is extremely disrespectful to Wikimedia as a whole. This is our public face and should not be used to attack other users. If you have a problem with another user, please keep it out of site instead of putting it right in an area intended for the public to see. The edit was highly unprofessional and I ask that you never make such attacks again. Ottava Rima 02:35, 18 September 2009 (UTC) Reply
  • I have started a discussion on the talk page of this page, to examine your use of administrator tools (ie. editing a protected page) to continue your revert-warring which you started prior to the page protection. Daniel (talk) 05:18, 18 September 2009 (UTC) Reply
    • warning - If you edit war through protection again, as you did here you may find yourself blocked. Make the case at the talk page but do not edit war. As an admin at multiple projects you should know better. ++Lar: t/c 12:00, 18 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Are you aware that with this edit you edited a template to add a comment? That was rather careless. An editor who is an admin on multiple projects would be expected to realise that. Or if they made a mistake, not have to rely on the good offices of someone else to clean it up. I'm suspecting that your passion in this matter is perhaps making your act rashly and without sufficient care, causing you to make simple mistakes, as well as say things that are not supportable. I note you have yet to answer why you felt it appropriate to edit through page protection. ++Lar: t/c 19:37, 20 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

You may be surprised that I am proud to make mistakes. If anything it proves that I actually do something. When I read what you write you give the impression that this whole thing takes a lot of my attention. It does not. It is a little affair that is only relevant because it is another instance where Mr Kohs abuses the wiki. Personally I find that it has taken too much of my time already. Thanks, GerardM 21:26, 20 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Then you should step away entirely, because in my view it's not been a good use of your time at all and your contributions are far from constructive so far. I note you have yet to answer why you felt it appropriate to edit through page protection. ++Lar: t/c 11:54, 21 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

The question is what is constructive. Reverting the nonsense of Mr Kohs was worthwhile. The removal is the best solution as far as I am concerned. This is in my objective a constructive aim as too much time has been wasted as a result of this gentlemen already. Thanks, GerardM 12:20, 21 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi Gerard,I am writing for the Zazaki Wiktionary project. As you told me, one of the requirements of opening a new wiki project is to translate "most-used MediaWiki messages", "all MediaWiki messages", and "all extensions used by Wikimedia Foundation wikis". We have so far only translated all of the "most-used MediaWiki messages" and half of the "all MediaWiki messages" for the Zazaki language. There are thousands of messages that are not translated, and we are having a hard time to translate all. That is because special status of the Zazaki language.

Zazaki language is spoken in Turkey. Between 1923 -2003 Zazaki was banned by the government, along with the Kurdish language. Only until 2003 some of the restriction in the Turkish law removed in favor of the Zazaki and Kurdish languages. However Zazaki is still cannot be thought in schools, and it is not a formal language. That is why the Zazaki language is mostly a non-literal language. Zazaki literacy has only peaked up around late 90’s.

Because the language was forced to stay as backward as possible in the past, translating all those Wikimedia messages is very hard. Zazaki is not like Turkish, Persian, or any other state language. There is almost no computer software translated to Zazaki. Zazaki lacks words that define many of the modern-day terms. Messages translated to Zazaki also do not make that much sense to a Zazaki speaker. Most of Zaza people know Turkish and English, and they use computer programs in English or Turkish. Is it possible for us to use either Turkish or English translation for the Zazaki Wiktionary? Then we can slowly translate other messages slowly. I believe that would make much more sense for us for the Zazaki Wiktionary project. --Xoser 04:13, 27 September 2009 (UTC) Reply

DONE! --Pyt 06:51, 8 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Determination of North Frisian:Mooringer North Frisian has frontal sch and frequently contains the character å. Other dialects have frontal sk but contain no å, â, ô, û. --Pyt 21:26, 12 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Please don't send me mail to attack other users. Guido den Broeder 10:01, 14 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Please read that mail again. It is not about other users, it is about your misrepresenting what is said about a given subject. Thanks, GerardM 10:37, 14 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

I stand corrected. You attacked TWO people, both me and the other user. Don't do it again. Guido den Broeder 11:45, 14 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

You do not stand corrected, because you are still not getting why you are wrong at what you did. GerardM 17:24, 14 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi

When I try to carry out any edit edit in the Hindi Wiktionary Test Site, I get the message: This wiki is closed

This is an active Wiki and I have not seen any prior proposal to close this wiki.

Can you please let me know as to what is happening?

Girmitya 12:15, 15 October 2009 (UTC) ..Reply

this looks good to me. I am not involved in the Incubator but there is no reason to deny this project.. You do know that you will have to do the full localisation ... Thanks, GerardM 21:19, 15 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Dear Gerard!

For reasons of time, I have neglected the Kirmanjki Wiktionary project and so it is now closed. I would like to continue the activity in this project again. Can you possibly help me here please? See also my talk on language committee. Best regards! --Mirzali 22:16, 15 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

This together with the blocking of Incubator pages and its new top line A proposal has been made to close this project. Please vote to close this wiki. is very alarming. --Pyt 20:44, 18 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Incubator will not be closed. Thanks, GerardM 06:46, 19 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Gerard, it seems like we have met all the requirements for the Zazaki Wiktionary project [4]. What is the next step and the time line? We would like to move to our new place as soon as possible. We would like to know if more needs to be done. Sooner we get our place, the better we can work. One of my partner is also wondering when this process will end. He doesn't know English. I am writing for him too. He says he has a lot of time these days and could contribute more in the new place. We also have many entries and it is becoming hard to work with prefixes (wt/diq). I look forward to hearing from you soon. Cheers. --Xoser 23:08, 31 October 2009 (UTC) Reply

Dear Gerard,

I thank my colleagues Xosere and Aspar for their great effort, although I am not satisfied with their translations of MediaWiki messages of Zazaki in 100%, because they made many grammatical mistakes, these need to be corrected. But we will correct them gradually too.

I'm also not necessarily happy on the requested Wiktionary, because on here the two (Xosere and Aspar) act against the will of others (all other Zazas) and try to enforce the Kurdish alphabet and they are writing everything with the Kurdish alphabet. That is absolutely not acceptable and needs necessarily to be changed. Please see my arguments against!--Mirzali 20:52, 1 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Dag Gerard! Ik heb even een vraagje, op de huidige versie van Wikipedie staat op 'veurblad' van nds-nl geen kop met "Veurblad" (dat heb ik zo ingesteld) maar als ik naar Beta ga, dan staat ie daar wel (zogenaamde: heading 1). Het tabblad "artikel" op de voorpagina staat in de huidige versie van Wikipedia wel goed ingesteld als 'veurblad / vuurblad' maar op de betaversie niet. Ik heb van alles geprobeerd maar het wil niet lukken, enig idee hoe ik dit weer goed kan krijgen? 92.254.96.174 16:05, 1 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Ik snap je vraag niet.. GerardM 16:22, 1 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Sorry, zo duidelijker? :P 92.254.96.174 18:06, 1 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Ik vermoed dat het in de CSS geregeld moet worden van de Vector skin. Dat is waar je grafische elementen kunt onderdrukken. GerardM 18:55, 1 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Ik heb Vector.css aangemaakt (gekopieerd van nl.wiki) maar dat maakt ook geen verschil verder. Heeft dat misschien ook iets met dat streepje te maken in "nds-nl" want ik zie dat fr.wiki en nl.wiki er verder geen last van hebben. Servien 10:18, 2 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Dear GerardM!

[I know that my English is not perfect. And I sorry for possible grammatical and stylistic errors.]

I am a professional anthropologist and at the same time, a man with considerable experience as a politician and as a party to legal conflicts. I am very interesting by those most bitter conflicts in the Wikipedia community around the creation of Wikipedia in those or other languages. This, in particular, the sharp conflicts over language: Volapük, Lombardian, Siberian, Klingon, Quenya, Toki Pona, Moldovan.

[I note that the closing pages of the Moldovan and Siberian languages was partly inspired by political motives, respectively, the representatives of Romanian and Russian languages. There is no doubt in the existence of a group of Siberian dialects of the Russian language, and there is no doubt in the existence of a formal written language, which was called "Moldovan" and was considered different from Romanian.]

I believe that decisions on these matters do not meet many of the panellists. This means that the problem of the continued functioning of languages of the Wikipedia needs more regulation. Should be introduced simple and obvious rules, which could satisfy all. Moreover, these rules should be considered obvious and fair to all members of the Wikipedia community.

These rules I have set out in the form of a few simple and universal legal norms. These rules have a few sources.

Main source: These rules follow from the main purpose of Wikipedia. The purpose of Wikipedia - creating the most complete and high quality on-line version of the encyclopedia in all languages of the Earth.

Second source: own practice of the Wikipedia community (especially the Language committee) in dealing with such issues, the presence in the practice of historical precedents.

The third source: the general universal principles of law that have proved themselves throughout the history of mankind, and which recognized the basic legal systems of almost all States, except in the most odious dictatorships. In this case there are two such universal principles:

1) A person shall not be liable for the acts of illegality which he could not have known. In particular, it should not be punished for acts which at the time they were committed were not illegal.

2) If people are free to enjoy certain rights, these rights they can not be taken away or limited. This is a very important universal principle, which dictates the obvious solution of a number of the most violent conflicts in the Wikipedia community.

Based on this latter principle, those languages that already have existing Wikipedia pages, or who have already obtained the right to create such pages in the wiki-Incubator, in any case can not be denied the right to own Wikipedia.

Because of this legal principle should be necessary to reopen the languages of the Wikipedia: Klingon, Toki Pona, Moldovan and Siberian.

On the other hand, these Wikipedias have been closed due to fair and honest reasons. So we must not allow the emergence of similar pages in the future. For this purpose, and should be taken these guidelines.

The general rules of language use in Wikimedia

A. Rules of use of existing languages in Wikimedia

1) Any language of Wikimedia may not be removed from it.

2) Administrators of each active Wikipedia in any language are obliged to care about the quality of Wikipedia articles. In particular, there is considered unacceptable the bot-creation of the main part of Wikipedia articles in any language.

In case of serious doubt as Wikipedia in this language guide Wikimedia Foundation may require the removal of all articles that have been bot-uploaded.

3) If necessary, bad-quality Wikimedia to correct the deficiencies can be returned to the Wiki-incubator.

4) In case if the language is used in two or more writing systems, separate sections for each type of writing is not created. Instead, is necessary to create a program that can translate the contents of any article on this language from one writing system into another.

We are welcoming the creation for any language of Wikipedia, program that gives the contents of articles into the International Phonetic Alphabet, as well as program that translates into the Latin transcription of the contents of articles in those languages, which made other writing systems.

B. Rules for the establishment of Wikipedia and Wiki-Incubator for new languages

1) In the Wikipedia and Wiki-incubator can be created sections in any native (living or dead) language, having the code ISO 639-3.

2) In the Wikipedia can be created partitions on any living language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) there are people for whom this language is native;

b) these language has a literature and electronic sites;

c) there is a scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

d) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

3) In the Wikipedia can be created sections on any recently extinct language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) The language died out not earlier than 1850;

b) there is a tutorial of the language;

c) these language has a literature and electronic sites;

d) there is the scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

e) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

4) In the Wikipedia can be created partitions on any dead language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) in that language existed and survived to the present day own rich literature;

b) there is a tutorial of the language;

c) these language has a modern literature and electronic sites;

d) there is the scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

e) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

5) All the languages that do not meet the criteria set out in paragraphs 1), 2), 3) and 4), are considered to be artificial.

In Wikipedia, there are sections of the following artificial (constructed) languages: Esperanto, Simple English, Ido, Novial, Intelingua, Interlingue (Occidental), Volapük, Lojban, Quenya, Klingon, Siberian, Toki Pona, and Lingua Franca Nova.

In the Wikipedia is not possible to create partitions on any other artificial languages.

As an exception, the decision to establish a section of Wikipedia in any other artificial language can be accepted by Wikimedia Board of Trustees. In this case the language must meet all the requirements of paragraph 4) for the dead languages and have code ISO 639-3 and a level of development and popularity of not less than the Quenya in 2009.

6) If a native language has the code ISO 639-3, but does not satisfy the conditions about 2) or 3) or 4), proposal of this language can be rejected.

I believe that the adoption of these rules will remove all the stress and all the discussions around the language policy of Wikipedia.

Best Regards,

Ihor Rassokha, Ukraine

At what rate translation project in incubation (incubator, wikisource or betawikiversity) can claim to be observed and followed with interest by the commitees. It would also be interesting to know the rate of monthly contributions is the second criteria. Does this rate may be added in terms of indication of maturity of a project ? Crochet.david 17:11, 12 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Personally I start looking at the content of projects once they have achieved the threshold for localisation. Often people signal when their localisation is done. Typically I am likely to notice when I do my monthly localisation updates on Wikipedias.

The prodding is welcomed. GerardM 17:19, 12 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

more than 80 % of "Extensions used by Wikimedia message" translated since 5 months and 5 monthly actives contributors since 5 months are a good starting to allow comittee to be noted with interest an incubating project ? Crochet.david 17:15, 13 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

The activity is recongised by the tool of Pathoschild. The point is that there is enough to start with, the localisation should be done and there is a start of a community.. Thanks, ~~

Hi Gerard,

I have seen it before and noticed it today again but I would like to ask you to not place comments like no anonymous cowards since Wikimedia and Wikipedia are based on the believe that everybody can edit it.

You protect a page with this comment so you believe that every ip that edits is a coward? I would like to say that there are people working as ip that do more and better work than you or me.

Could you please use more agf comments in the future?

Best regards, Huib talk 10:52, 14 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

I am involved in the language politics. I have found that most of the destructive comments are from anonymous cowards. Most of their remarks are damaging. Given that the languages policy asks people for their support, we require users to commit themselves. Your point is correct in many instances. It is not for things that have to deal with new languages and with the deletion of languages.

I do not consider anonymous requests to me personally as relevant. Also I disagree that there are ips that do a better job. Thanks, GerardM 10:58, 14 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Gerard, please stop editwarring on Public speakers. Of the users that showed up on talk, you are the only one who wants the page look like that. Guido den Broeder 14:11, 30 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

This is a formal warning, GerardM. You should know better. Stop edit warring over this. Majorly talk 14:38, 30 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

That is actually not the case. There are more people who have objected. This is only conveniently forgotten.. GerardM 16:41, 30 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

For what it's worth: as Mr. Den Broeder very well knows Gerard is right here: he was certainly not the only one who objected. Wutsje 16:49, 30 November 2009 (UTC) Reply

Hi, Gerard. Could you add information about the localization to the request? --Iltever 20:52, 23 December 2009 (UTC) Reply

Dear Gerard! We wish now that our project will be opened as soon as possible. Well, 100% of the most used MediaWiki messages have been translated. This is the recent localisation activity for our language. Thanks! P.S. My login does not work here. Someone must have me blocked. Can you please also change this? --Mirzali

• 500 of most messages were translated except 7 of them (with "Do not translate" direction) Yufereff 01:41, 2 January 2010 (UTC) Reply

i made a request page according to the instructions , here it is: [5]

i cant manage to add it to the request page cause i don't know where to put the code --Ilan David Frumer 17:45, 4 January 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hello Gerard! I have invited my friends and co-bloggers to help in the creation of Wikipedia Capisano. We are already two of us listed in the community interested for the creation. Oxyzen 04:43, 24 January 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hi. Could you add the license to the files that Crochet.david 07:56, 20 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

Please can you tell me how to communicate with the language committee, to appeal the recent rejection of a unified Norther Berber wikipedia? Here are the references: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikipedia_Tamazight http://www.mail-archive.com/wikipedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/msg00393.html

At the moment, there is a different Berber language variant spoken in each zone where the language survives, because the variants have been isolated from each other for centuries. The variants retain a clear common structure, pronunciation and vocabulary.

The Berber group (code ber) falls into two main groups, the Northern Berber group, and the Tuareg (Southern) group. Tuareg has an extended vowel system but is still similar.

Each variant within the two groups has achieved its own language code, such as the Moroccan variants Tachelhit, Central Moroccan Tamazight, and Tarifit.

There is confusion because the word Tamazight can be read to mean 'the Central Moroccan Tamazight variant of Berber', or to mean 'Tamazight the language group ber', or 'Tamazight the group of Northern variants'; or even 'a common Tamazight Northern Berber variant' which is the topic here.

The language variants are still geographically separated, but the Internet will now make a common Northern Tamazight language possible, and there is a great collective will to do this. (There is already a code for Tuareg as a unified language and not a language group, but that's understandable because Tuareg variants are more mutually intelligible and more effort has been made to create cross-border works).

The objective of a common Northern Berber literary language is compatible with the stated aims of the Language Committee. But it is the Internet and Wikipedia itself that can make convergence come about.

This is therefore an unusual case of a language that needs a code to describe itself before it can take root. Some authors have already written books that use compromise grammatical forms, and widely-understood vocabulary, and their work would be classed under this new code already.

1) I suggest therefore revisiting the proposal but giving it an x- private language code until the common language's iso-639-3 code has been requested and assigned. There is no risk that the new wiki will become redundant, given that the proposal looks to the future and not the past, and that it does not describe the language of a special interest group. On the contrary, there will be new energy, and the organizational features of Wikipedia are ideally suited to the task of crystallizing the language's use naturally.

2) The existing wikis for the Berber variants are in the Latin script, the civil society concensus. But the official script in Morocco for the Moroccan variants is Tifinagh. In Algeria there is no official script defined, but Latin is the civil society concensus.

I suggest therefore that the script component of the language code is very important for disambiguating the wikis, but it has not been considered as part of proposals and wiki codes so far.

People need to be able to create a Rifian wiki in Latin script and in Tifinagh. Time will tell which prevails, but conversion of texts is easy for editors. I presume that the implicit script understood from the language code alone is the one defined by the country's government, and not the civil society concensus. So the existing Rifian wiki would be rif-Latin, and rif alone would refer to the Tifinagh one. The same for Central Moroccan Tamazight and Tachelhit.

In Algeria, kab would presumably imply Latin since it's the de facto standard, the state has not defined a script, and very little has been written in anything else.

How can I put these two points to the language committee? Anderssakoul 16:03, 22 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

I will point the language committee to this section. Thanks, GerardM 16:35, 22 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

Thanks for the quick response. I'll join the discussion wherever it might pop up, or I can be emailed. Anderssakoul 18:35, 22 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

• Dear Gerrad ; sorry to bother you about this, as you might be aware there has been some problems due to User:Meno25 efforts in translating the arz messages , my self , Ramsis and Dudi were trying to rectify them as much as possible, Meno importsthe messages in Arabic not in Masry and as arz wikipedia is different this is causing some problems. One of them that the message about needed templates because some of the templates needed is due to the word معطيات replacing Country data , I tried to find this message to revert it to default but I can not find the message with معطيات replacing country data on translatewiki, would you mind helping me in this. Many thanks. Ghaly

Please ask such questions at support at http://translatewiki.net .. Thanks, GerardM 11:52, 24 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

can you check it? [[6]]

For a converged Tuareg-Tamazaq/Tamazeq language, assuming a language request is made and granted, I have a technical question about Wikipedia pages:

There could be a default script for the wiki shown first, with tabs at the top for alternatives, as for Serbian.

The content itself would be available in two encodings - in Latin script, transformed to Tifinagh one-way (or two way if capital letters are dealt with). But additionally the Tifinagh content needs to be shown with different fonts according to the region of the user - this is important.

Is it technically possible, if a user selects Tifinagh script, to make wiki pages specify different fonts (falling back to a sensible default) depending on which regional profile a user chooses? (The assumption is that each region will have well-known Tifinagh fonts appropriate to the letter repertoire used there).

Do you happen to know anyone who has experience of doing something similar for fonts? Anderssakoul 16:43, 27 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hoi, technically it is possible. As it is, your question is quite abstract. Is there a transliteration possible between what fonts ? The assumption is that the writing is indeed the same ? Thanks, GerardM 23:22, 27 February 2010 (UTC) Reply

Yes, the writing's exactly the same Unicode sequence - only the font for the pages changes per region (this changes the glyphs displayed for some of the code points, and captures the regional variations at some points in the script). Anderssakoul 01:19, 1 March 2010 (UTC) Reply

The wikipedians involved with the Central Moroccan Berber (Tamazight) wiki are interested in a common Berber language, and are keen to support the Tifinagh script for its historical and cultural resonance. They will probably use this wiki as a vehicle for common Berber anyway, rather than writing the wiki in the Middle Atlas Berber variant described by the language code. That exploits the confusion of 'Tamazight' the language group and 'Tamazight' the specific Moroccan variant. To avoid this, it would be better to create a separate wiki with a provisional code for the common Berber language. Doing this has three benefits:

• It avoids the Central Moroccan Tamazight wiki serving two purposes and being pulled in different directions
• It will support future proposal of the common Berber language code to ISO by giving unambiguous evidence of a common Berber language being used
• It highlights that the Central Moroccan wiki uses Tifinagh and the other wikis do not. That is not justified specifically for this particular dialect - the same factors affect the choice of script for the others, especially the Moroccan varieties where the state specifies Tifinagh but civil society mainly uses Latin. To avoid further confusion, the script tag part of the language identifier needs to be used in the wiki code, or some other solution such as different namespaces used so that the scripts can coexist for each language variant.

I've noticed that there have already been discussions about automatic interconversion of Latin and Tifinagh pages. What design was favoured, and did any implementation efforts get off the ground? Are the contributors still active? Anderssakoul 01:27, 1 March 2010 (UTC) Reply

Please fill this status page, thx --Dark Eagle 15:52, 13 March 2010 (UTC) Reply

The most used messages have been fully translated, what now we need for approving our project? --Dark Eagle 13:39, 21 April 2010 (UTC) Reply

up... how long we have to wait for Latgalian Wikipedia approval? --Dark Eagle 10:43, 28 May 2010 (UTC) Reply

There is a request pending to have an ISO 639-3 code assigned for the Llanito language, see:

• http://sil.org/iso639-3/chg_detail.asp?id=2010-013
• http://sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2010-013.pdf
• http://sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2010-013_llj.pdf

I am really hesitant to add this fact to the (final) page Requests_for_new_languages/Wikipedia_Llanito , but I would like to point supporters of a Wikipedia of Llanito to the fact. I expect them to have the request page on their watchtlists. Is there a better way for an alert? --Purodha Blissenbach 10:11, 19 April 2010 (UTC) Reply

Is the request to create a Persian wikinews ignored? Can you help please? 173.174.50.62 22:45, 31 May 2010 (UTC) Reply

No they are not.. I have updated the statistics for the required localisations. Thanks, GerardM 05:27, 1 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Thanks! I appreciate your efforts :) 173.174.50.62 08:36, 2 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

I'm very sorry, but what about Latgalian Wikipedia --Dark Eagle 13:10, 2 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Please write me 10 new articles that are of a rather large size (not stub sized). They will be used to ask an expert to confirm that it is proper Latgalian. The number of existing articles is low.. Once I have these 10 new articles, I am willing to propose to go to the next phase. Thanks, GerardM 10:41, 3 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

I'd like to invite you to express your opinion here: Proposals_for_closing_projects/Closure_of_Fulan_Wikipedia

Hi,

Before posting a request, I’d like ask you you two questions :

• it seems ok but can you confirm that br.wikisource is eligible ?
• we just re-launch the test on oldwikisource this weeks (oldwikisource:Degemer:Brezhoneg); how long should we wait before posting the request and then to have our project ? (in order to better organize ourself : te link to oldwikisource are not verry clean and we apparently have no possibility to fully test the Mediawiki breton interface). Is it a question of weeks/months/years ?

Cdlt, VIGNERON * ^discut. 14:12, 28 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Wikisource in Breton will be eligible, no worries there. The localisation for Breton is also almost complete. When the localisations is done, give us a signal so that we can mark the occasion. At the same time work on your source material and signal when you feel comfortable for a release.

As to testing the Breton interface, change your language to Breton and all the software that is localised will show up in Breton. Thanks, GerardM 14:19, 28 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Thank for the confirmation.

(削除) For some stange reason, extension messages (eg. proofread messages) dont show up in Breton even when the messages exist on translate wiki, do you know why? (削除ここまで)ThomasV answer us : proofread message can’t be localised.

A galon, VIGNERON * ^discut. 14:50, 28 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hi GerardM,
Wp/frr has made a lot of progress in the last year. Can you please give any advice, which next steps should be carried out to make the project ready for approval? Thanks! --Murma174 16:14, 29 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hello, Localisation of the MediaWiki messages and the messages of the extensions used by the Wikimedia Foundation projects has been Done. Could you please update the unofficial analysis page? Thanks. --Gapo 14:28, 30 June 2010 (UTC) Reply

To Whom it May Concern,

I recently noticed a Wiktionary incubator under the name "Western" Punjabi on Meta; as well as a Wikipedia under the same name that had been approved. I would like to take this opportunity to inform you that, while the language above exists, these projects are not written in this language, rather they are written in the Lahori sub-dialect of Eastern Punjabi; with the only real difference of being written in the Arabic script. Indeed, I transliterated the article on Lahore from the "Western" Punjabi Wikipedia to the Eastern Punjabi one, and it worked fine. Since I can read both scripts, I can tell you that this is not the language it claims to be. It is a shame, because those who actually speak that language will not be able to run a Wikipedia now. Please don't approve the Wiktionary at least, without confirming the language it is written in.

Many Thanks.

--92.21.135.101 16:16, 1 July 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.21.135.101 (talk) Reply

Hello Gerard,

I am one of the Breton Wikisource contributors. The project was given a new start recently. I think, along with the other contributors, that having a proper subdomain is an important goal. In my opinion, this would

• make interwiki linking cleaner,
• make it easier to watch recent changes,
• facilitate administration, if we can obtain a local sysop (I suppose so).

Currently, all the MediaWiki core messages have a Breton translation. If I understand correctly, all the extensions used by Wikimedia should be translated as well (currently 783 translations are missing, I intend to help there). Is there anything else to translate ?

As for numbers, we have 4 active contributors (the other 2 are inactive) and well over 100 pages, many of them using the Proofread extension.

In your opinion, what else do we need to request a subdomain ? Kouign-amann 15:41, 14 July 2010 (UTC) Reply

A request can be made at any time. It will be deemed eligible. Having us consider if you are ready will only be done once the localisation is done. Ping me when it is, Thanks, GerardM 17:00, 14 July 2010 (UTC) Reply

All right, we will do that. Thanks. Kouign-amann 11:20, 15 July 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hi. Re: Emperor has no clothes, there's a very interesting article about social websites at http://ifindkarma.posterous.com/pandas-and-lobsters-why-google-cannot-build-s that you might enjoy. (blogspot.com is being complicated, and not letting me comment. grumble grumble) Quiddity 19:39, 15 July 2010 (UTC) Reply

Hi. Our project(ckb.wikipedia) is not moved to beta, and logo is not changed to what we would like. Is that because of remaining several untranslated messages? if not, what is the problem? I asked this question on translatewiki, but siebrand wanted me to ask it at Wikimedia Language Committee. So if its not the right place to ask it, please guide me. Thanks --Marmzok 21:43, 18 August 2010 (UTC) Reply

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