Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Ships
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I recently revised and expanded USSKeresaspa and USSLydia(ID-3524). Each article is named by the ship's US Navy name, as they were begun as transcriptions from the DANFS. However, each ship is more notable for its shipwreck under a later name, so I suggest that the articles be moved to those names. Keresaspa became Malakoff, which in 1929 was wrecked off Menorca. 27 people were killed, and the ship now teems with marine life, which makes it a popular wreck diving site. Lydia became Manzoni, which a Fleet Air Arm Swordfish sank in 1940.
The Keresaspa article appears in the first page of internet search engine results for "SS Malakoff", so it could be argued that moving the article is not essential. However, the wreck still exists, known by the name Malakoff, so it would seem consistent to align the name of the article with the name by which she is currently best known. Manzoni was raised and scrapped; so her wreck no longer exists; hence the argument in her case may be less strong. However, I suggest that her being sunk in an air raid is perhaps the most notable event in her career, and thus her article should perhaps appear under her final name. I would be grateful for colleagues' opinions, before I figure out whether to move either article. Thankyou. Motacilla (talk) 10:23, 19 June 2026 (UTC) Reply
- In the absence of any replies either way, I have now moved USS Keresaspa to SSMalakoff. I have left USSLydia(ID-3524) where it is for the time being. Motacilla (talk) 08:20, 23 June 2026 (UTC) Reply
- hi Motacilla,
- I fully understand your issue, and I strongly support your suggestion to move the article to SS Malakoff.
- Your dilemma perfectly highlights the core problem we face across Wikipedia's maritime architecture: forcing a single article to "choose" between a brief military identity and a highly notable, long-term civilian or archaeological identity because our current category trees are flat and unindexed. When we name articles based purely on transient historical phases, we inadvertently cause data degradation and break the semantic web for researchers and automated search tools alike.
- I think the setup I propose for heritage ships directly solves this issue, ensuring that both the naval history and the wreck status are perfectly preserved without compromising the article's title. You can find the full blueprint for this system in my insert (now rejected because someone thinks its LLM generated - but is my setup in WikiProject Ships):
- "Proposal: Establishing Category:Maritime heritage to insulate metadata from algorithmic data degradation"
- Under this framework, we enforce an Object-Concept-Institution Bifurcation. Instead of tracking shifting names as entirely separate entities, we anchor the data metadata to the unchanging physical asset—using its unique Hull/Construction ID or IMO equivalent as the immutable primary key. The vessel's different historical phases are then routed to their correct taxonomic positions across a universal 4-Pillar framework using precise time-bound qualifiers (e.g., in Wikidata).
- Here is exactly how the SS Malakoff (ex-USS Keresaspa) is mapped into this architecture to resolve your naming conflict:
Category:Maritime / Kategorie:Schifffahrt [THE TOTAL MACRO ROOT] │ ├── [PILLAR 1] Category:Naval and sovereign maritime / Kategorie:Militärschifffahrt und Behörden │ └── Category:Naval vessels / Kategorie:Kriegsschiff │ └── [Redirect Node: USS Keresaspa] (Active: 1918–1919 Commissioning Period) │ └── Metadata Anchor: Registry/Hull ID (Tracks US Navy provenance) │ ├── [PILLAR 2] Category:Commercial and industrial maritime / Kategorie:Handelsschifffahrt und Marineindustrie │ ├── Category:Offshore energy infrastructure / Kategorie:Offshore-Bauwerke │ └── Category:Modern workships / Kategorie:Arbeitsschiff (Commercial cargo phase, 1922–1929) │ ├── [PILLAR 3] Category:Modern water sports and recreation / Kategorie:Moderner Wassersport │ └── Category:Modern sailing and regatta / Kategorie:Regattasegeln │ └── [PILLAR 4] Category:Maritime heritage / Kategorie:Maritimes Erbe [THE SYSTEMIC SANCTUARY] └── Category:Historic vessels by preservation and wreck status / Historische Schiffe und Wracks └── [Main Article: SS Malakoff] (Target Title via Principle of Archaeological Finality) └── Metadata Anchor: Registry/Hull ID (Tracks 1929 Menorca wreck & diving site)
- Why this approach works for your move proposal:
- The Principle of Archaeological Finality: Since the physical object still exists in the present day as the Malakoff wreck (attracting marine life and wreck divers), the physical hull's final, high-impact state determines the main article title. Moving it to SS Malakoff is the architecturally correct choice.
- Zero Loss of Naval Context: The historical phase as USS Keresaspa (1918–1919) is not erased. It remains an authoritative, indexed redirect node within Pillar 1 (Naval vessels). Search engines and AI scrapers won't hallucinate because the metadata links both names to the exact same hull registration file.
- Prevention of Category Pollution: This isolates the active navy lists from being cluttered by modern civilian wreck-diving data, while simultaneously giving the Malakoff a high-prestige, museum-grade sanctuary under Pillar 4 (Maritime heritage).
- By separating the physical object from its historical phases, we can confidently rename the article to its most notable final name without losing an ounce of its early naval identity. I would love to hear your thoughts on using this multi-pillar metadata routing as a standard for these types of multi-identity ship articles.
- Martijn 14:22, 26 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
A query raised at the Help Desk reveals that we need an article for the ship type kaag. Not to be confused with the medieval cog. Anyone up for writing it? Mjroots (talk) 07:47, 17 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
Proposal: Establishing Category:Maritime heritage to insulate metadata from algorithmic data degradation
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== Proposal: Establishing Category:Maritime heritage to insulate metadata from algorithmic data degradation ==
=== 1. Executive Summary & Core Conclusion ===
The global maritime taxonomy on Wikipedia is fundamentally compromised. By collapsing physical material assets (vessels), heavy industrial installations (oil rigs), unpowered sports gear (dinghies/kayaks), and legal administrative bodies (preservation societies/museums) into flat, unindexed categories, the encyclopedia actively drives data degradation. When data on Wikipedia is not organized typologically and based on a strict heritage taxonomy, automated translation bots, Wikidata integrators, and generative AI tools inevitably trigger contextual hallucinations and recursive feedback loops.
This structural collapse leads to non-compliance and immediate data erosion in two distinct ways:
'''Cross-Language Error Reproduction:''' Automated translation and list-generation bots ingest contaminated parent categories to systematically reproduce errors across language editions (e.g., establishing legal entities like the British ''National Historic Ships UK'', the German ''Förderverein Rahsegler e.V.'', or the Dutch ''FVEN'' as physical "floating" vessel objects).
'''The "Model Collapse" Feedback Loop:''' Because global LLMs train directly on Wikipedia's category graphs, this structural chaos poisons the wider semantic web. This corrupted external data is eventually re-ingested by Wikipedia editors as authoritative verification references, locking the encyclopedia into a toxic, recursive feedback loop.
Furthermore, when unique regional vessel classes transition over time from working craft to pleasure yachts (such as the ''Lemsteraak'' or the German ''Kriegsfischkutter''), the current system forces a false architectural dichotomy, destroying the historical narrative of the vessel's evolution.
To safeguard structural data integrity, we propose a comprehensive macro-overhaul that maps the entire nautical universe into '''Four Distinct High-Level Pillars''', establishing a strict, standard-aligned sanctuary for cultural properties. This framework is being submitted parallel to the German ''Portal:Schifffahrt'' to secure a synchronized Western European data bloc on Wikidata.
=== 2. Taxonomic Harmonization Note (Pre-emptive Structural Boundaries) ===
To ensure absolute taxonomic integrity across both platforms, this proposal explicitly enforces the platform-specific database guidelines without compromising the universal 4-Pillar separation of concerns:
- '''Grammatical & Structural Alignment (EN vs. DE):''' For en.wikipedia, categories will utilize standard plural naming conventions (e.g.,
Category:Historic vintage yacht classes) and act as broad thematic containers. For de.wikipedia, categories strictly adhere to the rigid singular systemic rule (''Kategorien-Systematik'') and localized terminology (e.g.,Kategorie:Historische YachtklasseandKategorie:Yacht-Einzelbau). - '''Economic & Industrial Bifurcation (The Service Split):''' To comply with the strict economic and industrial classification rules of de.wikipedia, design firms (e.g., Sparkman & Stephens) will not be conflated with manufacturing shipyards (
Kategorie:Werft). They are categorized underKategorie:Yachtkonstruktionsbürosas a service entity (Kategorie:Dienstleistungsunternehmen), structurally separating intellectual engineering from industrial asset production. - '''Multi-Axis Intersection (Schnittmengen-Systematik):''' Design history and architectural assets will not be subsumed under active sporting folders. Instead,
Category:Yachting and pleasure boating heritage/Kategorie:Kulturerbe des Yachtbauswill exist as a pure multidimensional intersection node, linking the human biography tree, the corporate economics tree, and the new global heritage roof.
=== 3. Visual Taxonomy Mapping: "As-Is" vs. "To-Be" ===
==== The Current Mess ("As-Is" Global Flaws & Inconsistencies) ====
Currently, there is no "Maritime heritage" umbrella/roof. Elements float disconnectedly in generic, technical, or chronological folders, mixing legal administrative bodies and activities with mechanical vessels.
Category:Maritime history [GLOBAL ROOT] ├── Category:Ships (Contains active battleships, modern cargo, AND 1929 historic yachts) └── Category:Sailing (Activity, human leisure, and sport incorrectly subordinated to mechanical hulls) Category:Scheepvaart [NL LOCAL MESS] └── Categorie:Varend erfgoed ├── [Federatie Varend Erfgoed Nederland (FVEN)] <── [ERROR: Legal administrative body in object list] └── Categorie:Lemsteraak └── [Artikel: De Groene Draeck] <── (Trapped in a false dichotomy: Work vs. Luxury Yacht) Category:Sailboats [TECHNICAL ROOT] └── Category:Sailboat type designs by Olin Stephens <── [ERROR: Trapped under basic technical gear] ├── [Artikel: Dorade (yacht)] └── [Artikel: Tenacious (yacht)]This framework maps identically across the EN and DE platforms, establishing immutable boundaries between Objects, Concepts, and Institutions.
Category:Maritime / Kategorie:Schifffahrt [THE TOTAL MACRO ROOT] │ ├── [PILLAR 1] Category:Naval and sovereign maritime / Kategorie:Militärschifffahrt und Behörden │ └── Category:Naval vessels / Kategorie:Kriegsschiff (Submarines, Battleships, Destroyers) │ ├── [PILLAR 2] Category:Commercial and industrial maritime / Kategorie:Handelsschifffahrt und Marineindustrie │ ├── Category:Offshore energy infrastructure / Kategorie:Offshore-Bauwerke (Oil rigs, Wind farms) │ └── Category:Modern workships / Kategorie:Arbeitsschiff (Active tugboats, commercial dredgers) │ ├── [PILLAR 3] Category:Modern water sports and recreation / Kategorie:Moderner Wassersport [PROPULSION-DIVERSIFIED] │ │ │ ├── Category:Recreational powerboating / Kategorie:Motorbootsport (Modern motor cruisers) │ │ │ ├── Category:Modern sailing and regatta / Kategorie:Regattasegeln │ │ └── Category:One-design racing and recreational sailing classes / Kategorie:Einheitsklasse (Segeln) │ │ ├── [Article: ILCA (Laser)] & [Article: J/70] │ │ └── [Article: Polyvalk] (Modern GRP instruction boat) │ │ │ └── Category:Unpowered water sports and oarsmanship / Kategorie:Muskelkraftbetriebener Wassersport │ ├── Category:Competitive and Olympic rowing classes / Kategorie:Rudersport ── [Article: Olympic eight (8+)] │ └── Category:Recreational unpowered craft / Kategorie:Freizeitrudersport ── [Article: Inflatable kayak] │ └── [PILLAR 4] Category:Maritime heritage / Kategorie:Maritimes Erbe [OUR NEW UNIFIED PROPOSAL ROOF] │ ├── Category:Maritime heritage infrastructure / Kategorie:Historische maritime Infrastruktur │ └── Category:Lighthouses / Kategorie:Leuchtturm (Preserved historical monuments) │ ├── Category:Maritime heritage institutions / Kategorie:Maritime Institutionen [NEW] │ ├── Category:Maritime preservation societies / Kategorie:Traditionsschiff-Vereine │ │ ├── National Historic Ships UK (Administrative body) │ │ ├── Förderverein Rahsegler e.V. (Preservation society) │ │ └── Federatie Varend Erfgoed Nederland (FVEN) (National federation) │ │ │ └── Category:Maritime museums / Kategorie:Schifffahrtsmuseum │ ├── National Maritime Museum Greenwich (UK) │ ├── Deutsches Schifffahrtsmuseum Bremerhaven (DE) │ └── Het Scheepvaartmuseum Amsterdam (NL) │ ├── Category:Historic vessels by design type / Kategorie:Historisches Schiff nach Konstruktionstyp │ │ │ ├── Category:Historic vessels by country of origin / Kategorie:Historisches Schiff nach Ursprungsland │ │ ├── Category:Historic vessels of the United Kingdom ── [Article: Thames skiff] │ │ ├── Category:Historic vessels of Germany ── Category:Kriegsfischkutter class │ │ └── Category:Historic vessels of the Netherlands ── Category:Lemsteraak class │ │ │ ├── Category:Historic commercial and work vessels / Kategorie:Historisches Arbeits- und Nutzschiffe │ │ └── Category:Traditional fishing and utility vessels / Kategorie:Historisches Fischereifahrzeug │ │ ├── Category:Lemsteraak class <───┐ (BRIDGES BOTH INLAND WORLDS) │ │ └── Category:Kriegsfischkutter class <────┼──┐ (NO ARTICLE SPLITTING REQUIRED) │ │ │ │ │ └── Category:Historic vintage yacht classes / Kategorie:Historische Yachtklasse [NEW] │ ├── Category:Traditional inland yachts / Kategorie:Historische Binnenyacht │ │ ├── Category:Lemsteraak class [MIGRATE] <─┘ │ │ │ └── Category:Kriegsfischkutter class <───────┘ │ │ │ ├── Category:International Twelve Metre class [EXISTING GLOBAL CLASS] │ ├── Category:Historic regional open classes / Kategorie:Historische Jolle ── [Article: 16m2 (BM)] │ └── Category:One-off yacht designs / Kategorie:Yacht-Einzelbau (One-off) [NEW] │ └── [Article: Dorade (yacht)] <── [OUR CORE METADATA BENCHMARK CASE] │ └── Category:Yachting and pleasure boating heritage / Kategorie:Kulturerbe des Yachtbaus [NEW INTELLECTUAL ROOF] └── Category:Historic yacht designers / Kategorie:Historischer Yachtkonstrukteur ├── [Biography Article: Olin Stephens] (The Main Human Anchor Node) └── Category:Naval architecture firms / Kategorie:Yachtkonstruktionsbüros [NEW / SERVICE NODE] └── Category:Designs by Sparkman & Stephens [MIGRATE EXISTING TO CONCEPT BRANCH] └── [Article: Dorade (yacht)] (Cross-reference label on article page)=== 4. Explanatory Note: Addressing Regional Precedents ===
A critical reviewer may ask: "Why does this proposal highlight regional examples (e.g., Lemsteraak) alongside global cases, and why has this not been deployed on the local regional Wikipedia editions first?"
We explicitly present this to the EN and DE teams parallel for two structural reasons:
'''The Regional Governance Lock:''' Local language editions are frequently bottlenecked by localized editors with direct institutional ties to regional preservation societies. These groups favor flat "all-in-one" directories for internal membership visibility, which violates global Wikipedia categorization guidelines and pollutes the Wikidata graph.
'''Mondial Data Purity:''' Over 50% of research-driven traffic in non-English/non-German regions defaults directly to the English and German editions for comprehensive archival verification. Establishing a high-prestige, data-pure standard on the EN and DE platforms creates an irreversible top-down precedent. By resolving the ''Lemsteraak-paradox'' alongside the German ''Kriegsfischkutter'' and British ''Thames skiff'', we prove that this structural layout solves a universal European heritage problem that local wikis are politically paralyzed to fix.
=== 5. Technical Implementation: The Transnational Registry Standard ===
To guarantee data purity against automated translation bots and generative AI scrapers, every historic vessel under this framework must implement this standardized infrastructure profile. We deploy the iconic '''Dorade (1929)''' as our international benchmark case:{{Infobox Historic Vessel / Transnational Heritage Standard}}
| Production Type = One-off Unique Design --> Maps to: [[Category:One-off yacht designs]]
| Intellectual Anchor = Olin Stephens --> Maps to Wikidata: P287 (Designer) -> Q713151
| Corporate Anchor = Sparkman & Stephens --> Maps to Wikidata: P176 (Manufacturer) -> Q2301131
| Original Shipyard = Minneford Yacht Yard --> Location: City Island, New York, USA
| Country of Origin = United States --> Maps to Sovereign Layer Geography (P495)
| Construction Year = 1929 --> Maps to: [[Category:1929 ships]]
| Launch Year = 1930 --> Maps to Chronological Database
| Rig Type = Yawl --> Technical Hull Class
| Hull Material = Wood (Oak & Mahogany) --> Material Composition
| LOA (Length Overall)= 52 ft 6 in (16.00 m) --> Verified Registry Metric
| Beam (Width) = 10 ft 3 in (3.12 m) --> Verified Registry Metric
| Draft (Depth) = 8 ft 3 in (2.51 m) --> Verified Registry Metric
| Displacement = 15.2 metric tons --> Mass/Weight Metric
| Historic Impact = 1931 Transatlantic Race Winner / 1931 Fastnet Race Winner
| Present Location = Museum Collection --> Cross-tags to: [[Category:Maritime museums]]
| Official Heritage ID= NHS-UK #1104 / RVEN Eq --> Maps to Wikidata: P3844 (Heritage Status)
=== 6. Call to Action: Roadmap to Implementation ===
To deploy this taxonomy without disrupting active community pipelines, we request the joint boards to greenlight a '''Three-Stage Phase-In''':
- '''Phase 1 (Structural Approval):''' Formally approve the creation of the parent node
Category:Maritime heritage(Kategorie:Maritimes Erbe) and its core sub-branches (institutions,country of origin,historic vintage yacht classes). - '''Phase 2 (The Alpha Clean-Up):''' Execute the migration of non-tangible assets (such as ''National Historic Ships UK'' and ''Förderverein Rahsegler e.V.'') out of physical hull folders and into the new institutional branch.
- '''Phase 3 (Wikidata Bot Integration):''' Deploy automated SPARQL/Listeria query scripts to dynamically map verified heritage vessels into the new multilingual category tables based on property
P3844.
We invite the coordinators of '''WikiProject Ships/Sailing''' and '''Portal:Schifffahrt''' to review this framework, establish consensus on this talk page, and initiate the parent category creation.
Cape Sepias (talk) 00:17, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- Quick comment, Substitute "warships" for "battleships'. The latter term refers to a particular type of warship. Murgatroyd49 (talk) 06:36, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- Murgatroyd49, this is something I will leave to the editor of classes/categories in the relevant Pillar and the supervisors for that area. I included the pillar to show the overall fit. Martijn 21:50, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- @Cape Sepias - We ask people not to post AI-generated proposals, because they tend to be very long and wordy and very difficult to make sense of, and this is a perfect example of it. Could you summarise what you're asking for in a couple of sentences, in your own words? I don't think I can quite make sense of what you think the problem is, or what you think we should do about it. Andrew Gray (talk) 17:22, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- it's my own proposal. Not LLM generated. In a few words: The taxonomy in the maritime part of wikipedia lacks coherency. My proposal is focused on maritime heritage, but I wanted my proposal to show the optimizations needed in the overall maritime part. I did not fully drill down in the part about naval, industry, however, took some examples to be sharpened. Martijn 21:43, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- @Andrew Gray Martijn 20:55, 29 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- I don't think our category system works the way you think it should work. It is hierarchical, yes, but it is ultimately intended for human navigation and is not intended to be a formal or perfect taxonomy of concepts. Andrew Gray (talk) 22:16, 29 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- dear, @Andrew Gray: well, i think it will help for human navigation, whatever label we will give it. Currently some categories are not to be found. however, if you suggest we leave this but create categories thst cover the topics, that could bring us to the sasme reseult. how do you suggest to move forward and how will it be formalized and activated?
- 16:29, 31 July 2026 (UTC) Martijn 16:29, 31 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- I don't think our category system works the way you think it should work. It is hierarchical, yes, but it is ultimately intended for human navigation and is not intended to be a formal or perfect taxonomy of concepts. Andrew Gray (talk) 22:16, 29 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- @Andrew Gray Martijn 20:55, 29 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- it's my own proposal. Not LLM generated. In a few words: The taxonomy in the maritime part of wikipedia lacks coherency. My proposal is focused on maritime heritage, but I wanted my proposal to show the optimizations needed in the overall maritime part. I did not fully drill down in the part about naval, industry, however, took some examples to be sharpened. Martijn 21:43, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- Comment - 1) the proposal is long and confusing - whether written by LLm or not - most editors will not be bothered to read through the whole thing to work out what you want to do. 2) en:Wikipedia's category system is for the use of human users not for training LLMs or other databases. Why should the whole encyclopedia's categorisation system be changed? How would this affect the encyclopedia's users? (such changes, whatever they are, could not only be applied to Maritime projects - they would have apply to the whole of wikipedia). 3) Maritime (and indeed other subjects don't necessarily fit solely in single clearly definable boxes. A single ship could serve in military, commercial and private (i.e. as a yacht or the like) at different parts of its career. HMS Victory is a physical warship and a maritime museum.Nigel Ish (talk) 19:42, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- I hoped to give structure to the document, as I did with the setup. I believe in a beter taxo. Besides the issues and dangers with LLMs, it also proves our taxo is not correct. Thats why I propose the setup, with a focus on the maritime heritage part, where it lacks full structure. With a larger scope I hope to show the overall impact (limited, an were it does, it helps to structure). Martijn 21:36, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- Nigel, the HMS Victory is a physical warship. So a ship. With regards to the maritime museum, it is the housing. A museum is part of cat. Maritime Heritage Instititions. Its a social activity. Not a ship itself. Martijn 21:56, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- pitty editors would not be bothered
- its for humans and the setup improves for humans. I might have taken my context a bit too much into new developments. I think the "Move suggested for Keresaspa and Lydia" suggestion shows why we should want a taxo that facilitates structure for editors, and visitors alike.
- As mentioned earlier, i miss my reply here, a museum is not an object. its a socio-economic thing. So categorized underneath: Category: Maritime heritage institutions, in Category Maritime Museums. The Museum could be described as a museum within the ship the HMS Victory, that would be in the category: Naval and sovereign maritime heritage / specific class used in this part of maritime heritage
- Martijn 17:54, 26 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- t's my own proposal. Not LLM generated. In a few words: The taxonomy in the maritime part of wikipedia lacks coherency. My proposal is focused on maritime heritage, but I wanted my proposal to show the optimizations needed in the overall maritime part. I did not fully drill down in the part about naval, industry, however, took some examples to be sharpened. ~~~ Martijn 21:45, 25 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
- Over the last day I got a bit angry, unmighty. I have spent a lot of days finetuning my proposal, translating my propoal in readable English, and now, all the weeks thinking about the best structure, days of working it out, would end in someone/something telling me its not made by me?? Who is this? Martijn 13:53, 26 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
I imagine I'm in the wrong over at Talk:List of ships sunk by torpedoes after 1945 §Croatian patrol boat Šolta, as someone's responded with a list of Croatian sources that use the word "torpedo". Still, if anyone's bored I'd love to get their input as the weapon as described really, really does not sound like a torpedo. Ed [talk] [OMT] 01:22, 28 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:James Murray (Polish navy)#Requested move 28 July 2026 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ~2026-41965-57 (talk) 13:29, 28 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:HSC Fares 2#Requested move 24 July 2026 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Thanks! —1isall (talk | contribs) 23:53, 31 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:HSC Express 2#Requested move 24 July 2026 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Thanks! —1isall (talk | contribs) 23:54, 31 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
There is a requested move discussion at Talk:HSC Eurochampion Jet 2#Requested move 24 July 2026 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Thanks! —1isall (talk | contribs) 23:54, 31 July 2026 (UTC) Reply
A proposal to rename hundreds of shipwreck categories is being discussed at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2026 August 2 § Maritime incidents by time period. Please feel free to comment. Mjroots (talk) 15:56, 3 August 2026 (UTC) Reply