Talk:Righteous armies

More background?

Article needs to be improved

April 2019

Plural title

Requested move 1 September 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Righteous army → Righteous armies – Per WP:PLURAL, I think the various righteous armies are a class of things. It's also immediately clearer that the scope covers multiple armies instead of just one. I myself was confused about which army this would be about until I read the lead. toobigtokale (talk) 11:47, 1 September 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. The Night Watch (talk) 13:57, 8 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

• Oppose per WP:SINGULAR. I don't think the exception to titles being rendered in the singular form as a "class of things". Rreagan007 (talk) 19:16, 8 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

  I don't quite understand due to grammar; could you rephrase? toobigtokale (talk) 20:10, 8 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

  If I had to guess at what your point means (plural should be classes of things, not a single class), I disagree.

  The examples given in WP:PLURAL support my argument, and it's an acceptable standard.

  • Articles on groups of distinct entities that are nevertheless often considered together (preceded almost invariably by the word "the"), such as the Florida Keys, the Americas, or the Rivers of New Zealand.
  • Things like Maxwell's equations, Legendre polynomials, Chebyshev polynomials, [the] Cauchy–Riemann equations, etc

  The first bullet clearly applies here. The second bullet shows that a single class of things can be plural ("Maxwell's equations" is a single set, not multiple sets). toobigtokale (talk) 22:56, 9 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

  Examples of other similar articles using plural (varying quality, I know examples alone don't imply a standard, but they can be used as supporting evidence)

  • Presidency armies
  • List of Soviet armies
  • Green armies
  • Hellenistic armies
  • Armies of the Imperial Japanese Army
  • Army groups of the National Revolutionary Army
  • Neo-Confederates
  • International sanctions during the Russian invasion of Ukraine

  You can see in several of these uses they're clearly a singular class of things. toobigtokale (talk) 23:01, 9 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

  @Rreagan007 Response? toobigtokale (talk) 23:09, 12 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

Comment: @Paine Ellsworth Earlier today, I disambiguated this article for the sake of clarity, but seem to have accidentally stepped on some toes. I apologize for that. My impression was that this (削除) RfC (削除ここまで) discussion was about whether to change this article name from the singular to the plural. Disambiguating it from other uses of those terms, I thought, was irrelevant to that.

This article's hatnote led me to find three more notable uses of the term "righteous army" during the Boshin War, Russo-Japanese War, and in the hostilities prior to the Second Sino-Japanese War. There are semantic differences between the Chinese characters used for the Korean righteous armies (義兵) and the eponymously translated Japanese/Japanese-affiliated militias (義軍) that are very challenging to differentiate in English. Because of that, the name of this article ought to be revised with a disambiguator whatever the outcome of this (削除) RfC (削除ここまで) discussion's question. —CurryTime7-24 (talk) 21:09, 14 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

Sorry that had to be done, editor CurryTime7-24. There is some controversy when an article is renamed to any title while a formal move request is still open. Your new page has been dabified at Righteous army (disambiguation), so nothing is lost. In cases like this, undiscussed page moves should be minimized, and since "Righteous army" is now the base name for this article's subject, this article is considered to be the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for its subject. To move this page to a qualified Righteous army (Korea) will require a fresh move request at some point after this one has been closed. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 21:32, 14 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

Note: WikiProject Korea has been notified of this discussion. UtherSRG (talk) 15:59, 19 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

Note: WikiProject Military history has been notified of this discussion. UtherSRG (talk) 16:00, 19 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]

• Support. From a quick perusal of the article, it seems that the righteous armies were loose, grassroots forces that organized at various times on an ad-hoc basis; consequently, I think the plural title best conveys these nuances (whereas a singular title might give the impression of a specific individual army, or an organized force with consistent activities). I also agree with the nominator's argument that the righteous armies are "a group or class of specific things" as outlined by WP:PLURAL. ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 16:31, 20 September 2023 (UTC) [reply ]