RE: newbie: how to modify lua code while the program is running like visual basic
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- Subject: RE: newbie: how to modify lua code while the program is running like visual basic
- From: yoyomeltz yoyomeltz <yoyomeltz@...>
- Date: 2012年6月25日 18:34:01 +0000
thanks for the reply.
i have been able to dynamically reload a module. that works fine.
no debbuger needed.
i posted some sample code to this list.
________________________________
> Date: 2012年6月24日 00:01:27 +0100
> From: robert.virding@erlang-solutions.com
> To: lua-l@lists.lua.org
> Subject: Re: newbie: how to modify lua code while the program is
> running like visual basic
>
> I am not a Lua expert so I don't know how it handles this.
>
> To modify code inside a debugger or IDE is the easy part. The
> interesting part is doing it in running production systems. For that
> you need a very clear definition of what it means to load code and how
> this affects the system. For example if you reload a function which
> someone is executing how will it be affected. You need support from the
> underlying system/implementation to do this. I come from another world,
> erlang, where this is defined and it is only because it is defined that
> you can dynamically manage code at runtime.
>
> So something similar would be needed in Lua to do this properly. It
> depends, of course, whether this is a goal for the language or not.
>
> Robert
>
> ________________________________
> Philippe, thanks for the reply.
> so i am been programming in Basic for over 38 years.
> my first computer had a version of basic hand-coded by bill gates, in
> the 1970's.
>
> yes, it is true that visual basic does require the use of an IDE but
> visual basic for application does have a interactive console.
> yes, i use print() and that works and only for people who cannot do
> edit-and-continue are doomed to be punished with just print().
> not a very nice solution when i am trying to teach programming concepts
> to children.
>
> lol, i used to program using punch cards on an ibm mainframe, perhaps
> we should downgrade back to that, who needs keyboards anyway...
>
> since i first asked my question, and based on some posts and doing some
> research, edit-and-continue can in fact be done for Lua from the
> interactive console.
>
> it is much more then a crutch or convenience.
> anybody that has not tried it should not trivialize it.
> all the more so for Lua.
> Lua is designed to be a embedded solution, often used by non-programmers.
> for example, arrays indexes start from 1, not zero.
>
> you should take a look at the posts by Kevin T. Ryan.
> one example of what he wrote is:
> "You may want to try ZeroBrane Studio:
> >>
> http://notebook.kulchenko.com/zerobrane/live-coding-in-lua-bret-victor-style";
>
> after looking at the videos, let me know what you think. youtube has
> some great videos.
> look at the zues editor for Lua videos
> thanks and enjoy.
>
> > To: lua-l@lists.lua.org
> > From: PhiLho@GMX.net
> > Date: 2012年6月22日 14:44:44 +0200
> > Subject: Re: newbie: how to modify lua code while the program is
> running like visual basic
> >
> > On 21/06/2012 21:41, yoyomeltz yoyomeltz wrote:
> > > kevin, thanks you much. it does seem to offer what i wanted but the
> problem is i would be
> > > locked into an ide that does not seem to offer much else.
> > >
> > > there has to be a simple way to dynamically reload code as needed via a
> > > console/command.line or other simple solution.
> > > if visual basic from microsoft can do it and python can do it, then
> why should i be an
> > > issue for Lua.
> > > even visual basic 6.0 from 10 years ago can do that.
> > >
> > > it seems to me this such a feature is a pre-requisite for learning
> any language, espcially
> > > a lightweight scripting language.
> > > so does anybody have any other suggestions?
> >
> > Well, if I am not mistaken, VB is "locked into an IDE"...
> > I don't know for Python.
> > Debugging is often tied to an IDE anyway, unless you are using some
> command line debug
> > tool (but that's still a tool, often separate of the compiler /
> interpreter, no?).
> >
> > Eclipse (and probably other Java IDEs as well) allows such hot fix,
> changing code while
> > running and the program continue to run with this change.
> > Now, it has some limitations: if you change a method while debugging
> in it, Eclipse puts
> > the current program line pointer to the start of the method.
> > If you change deeply a class, eg. the visibility of a method, or a
> new method, it tells
> > you it can't do the hot fix and shows markers in the debug stack
> trace to show the code is
> > no longer synchronized.
> >
> > So it isn't a perfect feature for every language / IDE. Just a very
> convenient feature!
> >
> > Note: don't under-evaluate the power of print() in tracing /
> debugging Lua! :-)
> >
> > --
> > Philippe Lhoste
> > -- (near) Paris -- France
> > -- http://Phi.Lho.free.fr
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> >
> >
> >
> >
>