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wooly wrote: ↑Sat Nov 30, 2024 5:56 pm1. it start and shut down before even activating the monitor so i call it "refusing"ejolson wrote: ↑Fri Nov 29, 2024 4:43 pmNot 'refused.'
"Not recognised by the (non-existent) PD negotiation as being capable of delivering 5 amps" would be a more accurate statement.Here demanding means connecting any storage device to USB or a PCIe m.2 hat.Except under very demanding usage an RPi5 can run perfectly well from a 3 amp supply.
Whether or not a 3A PSU is PD capbale shouldn't matter. The Pi5 ask for 5A@5V and assume 3A@5V if it doesn't get it or if the PSU is not PD. In which case it will restrict USB current to a total of 600mA unless configured to do otherwise (search the forum, it's come up many times over the last year).2. some friends having RPI5 told that were happy with a 3A PSU they previously used on a Pi4, so i trusted them.
3. with a PD compliant 3A it works, but has problems with PCIe m.2 expansion [not hat since is not connected to GPIO] when an high rate of I/O is made.
The producer of the board when I asked how to connect to the extra 2 pins for a 5V supply replied that for memories less than 1TB the supply from the PCIe cable is enough, and this was confirmed even here, telling that since the PCIe on RPI5 uses only one lane the power requirement of the "official" ssd tagged as 2.4A were acceptable.
Also the boot did not complain when booting from nvme with 3A .
It looks that it was not marked enough strong in the various documentation that the limits on power supply does apply not only to USB boot, but also to nvme boot [or using heavily the nvme after boot]
For this I was unhappy.
4. someone here said that I should have complained to the courier or the supplier: if i order from the local distributor I would pay 13,25€ for the PSU and 9€ for shipping (and if courier do not find me at home I have to go to collect 20 km away) or i have to collect at their shop ... 340 km away from here. My usual supplier for these devices ship for free click and collect but only for orders over 40€ [and it sell for 16€]
They sell to official resellers (and others, as do resellers) and set a recommended retail price (excluding shipping and taxes). You buy from a reseller. The reseller decides how much to charge for shipping and handling. If your package goes missing you take that up with the seller or with the delivery company (depending on local laws).
5. what happen if i connect the second exit from my PSU [that has 3 3A capable exits, up to 40W total] to some 5V point [which is better?] in the RPi5 or the M2 adapter? will the on-off switch continue to work?
since it does not arrive to write the log is difficult to explain.
PCIe ribbon. Other people had same device and afaik noone had problem due to insufficient supply (in theory should be 850mA )If the board is not connected to GPIO, how is it connected? The PCIe ribbon? USB?
The PCIe ribbon supports a maximum of 1A. If your drive needs more than that it won't work reliably. Or at all.
Absolutely not, the problem is for a lot of product, and for many peopleYour delivery problems are not specific to buying a PI PSU. They're not RPL's responsibility either.
is not lying: it has three output (one "plain", 5V/3A only, and two PD: fineprints in instructions says that the advertised 40W may be achieved only with one output at 9V/2.8A and one at 5V/3.1 A, the other possible combinations are the two PD at 9V/2A, or any two outputs at 5V/3A . Else If you use all the three you may draw a maximum of 10W each one.Electrically speaking? I've no firm idea. What I can say is:
- 3 x 3A@5V is a total of 45W so the PSU spec is lying to you. A 40W PSU cannot deliver 45W regardless of how many outputs it has.
- It depends on how well each output is regulated and on other factors (like voltage drop in the cables and connectors). If the voltages are not the same on each output at the Pi, current will flow in the wrong direction.
bensimmo wrote: Or bring your own 5V5A and make you own and run it through the GPIO or similar (...)
As for crashing? Other Pi models reduce/limit speed, I know the Pi3 crawls in that mode, but that's on a voltage drop. If the current ramps up the voltage may just drop too far too quickly or the PSU shuts down too.
Also the boot did not complain when booting from nvme with 3A .
But when using a lot due to swapping it hang
so it would explain why even if now there is a sd card to run the system, but the nvme is still in place but not used, has no longer complained.
Absolutely not, the problem is for a lot of product, and for many people
is not lying: it has three output (one "plain", 5V/3A only, and two PD: fineprints in instructions says that the advertised 40W may be achieved only with one output at 9V/2.8A and one at 5V/3.1 A, the other possible combinations are the two PD at 9V/2A, or any two outputs at 5V/3A . Else If you use all the three you may draw a maximum of 10W each one.
About flowing in the wrong direction: it could occour in any case you supply in two points, but then the supply should be able to balance the few mV difference.
What is official way to tell Pi5 not to go over a certain speed [say 1.8 GHz] and how many mA would shave out [would be nice since it would reduce also the average consumption] ?
Maybe the difference is that I have 500GB so a few mA more .
That does not say anything. At least you need to know yourself what the specification of the storage solution is. And do power budget calculation. Also please post them here.
Before getting the NVMe SSD my Pi 5 was booting/running from a USB 3 connected SATA SSD. Power was a claimed 2.5A from an audio AMP HAT. Zero issues.ejolson wrote: ↑Fri Nov 29, 2024 5:26 pmIt might be possible to override the power limits on the USB ports and pretend one has a 5A supply even when it's not and then successfully mount an external drive. Even if it works at first, the SSD could draw more power over time as it wear levels while the under-specified power supply may age and fail at the wrong end of the bathtub.
It is exactly what happened ... not nice on pi part ... and it explains why booting from a sd card does not make the same effect.
what worries me is that it shuts down current before trying other things to reduce load [such throttling] and, the louder complaint, that all documentation say the it would limit the usb output to 0,6A but no mention on the output on the PCIe bus [confirmed that if you start via USB you get on boot a loud remind, but nothing if you start from PCIe ...]thagrol wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:47 amWould you rather have the Pi dump all the available current through a short, start a fire, and burn down your house? With no protection on the PI you're relying on the RCD or fuse in the plug or breaker panel to protect you.
You Pi does not, and cannot, know if the over current it detects is peaking at a few (tens?) of mA or it's the start of a much larger draw. It seems the designers have decided to err on the side of caution and cut power to down stream USB devices before damage can occur to the Pi, the PSU, your home's wiring, life, and limb. A sensible thing to do in my opinion.
I think it does throttle when undervoltage occurs. However, I suspect that would not be fast enough to cope with a sudden increase in power demand, and given the Pi 5 cannot predict the future, you cannot pre-emptively slow things down as you have no idea what is just about to happen.wooly wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:18 pmwhat worries me is that it shuts down current before trying other things to reduce load [such throttling] and, the louder complaint, that all documentation say the it would limit the usb output to 0,6A but no mention on the output on the PCIe bus [confirmed that if you start via USB you get on boot a loud remind, but nothing if you start from PCIe ...]thagrol wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:47 amWould you rather have the Pi dump all the available current through a short, start a fire, and burn down your house? With no protection on the PI you're relying on the RCD or fuse in the plug or breaker panel to protect you.
You Pi does not, and cannot, know if the over current it detects is peaking at a few (tens?) of mA or it's the start of a much larger draw. It seems the designers have decided to err on the side of caution and cut power to down stream USB devices before damage can occur to the Pi, the PSU, your home's wiring, life, and limb. A sensible thing to do in my opinion.
For your soul's peace: there is an overload breaker in the socket where my PSU is plugged.
While I entirely support having both an appropriately rated MCB (circuit breaker) and an RCD (residual current device) on every mains circuit, this will not protect against the effects of a fault on the low voltage side of a switched mode PSU. By nature these isolate the output from mains, so there can be no earth leakage faults.* While the PSU is working properly, it will limit output current to its maximum rating, but that could be enough to start a fire n the wrong circumstances.wooly wrote: For your soul's peace: there is an overload breaker in the socket where my PSU is plugged.
I always thought that tingling was because "Das komputermaschine ist nicht für der gefingerpoken und mittengrabben."
How long til the AI HATs/NPU can do that for the Pi5jamesh wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:48 pmI think it does throttle when undervoltage occurs. However, I suspect that would not be fast enough to cope with a sudden increase in power demand, and given the Pi 5 cannot predict the future, you cannot pre-emptively slow things down as you have no idea what is just about to happen.wooly wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:18 pmwhat worries me is that it shuts down current before trying other things to reduce load [such throttling] and, the louder complaint, that all documentation say the it would limit the usb output to 0,6A but no mention on the output on the PCIe bus [confirmed that if you start via USB you get on boot a loud remind, but nothing if you start from PCIe ...]thagrol wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 2:47 amWould you rather have the Pi dump all the available current through a short, start a fire, and burn down your house? With no protection on the PI you're relying on the RCD or fuse in the plug or breaker panel to protect you.
You Pi does not, and cannot, know if the over current it detects is peaking at a few (tens?) of mA or it's the start of a much larger draw. It seems the designers have decided to err on the side of caution and cut power to down stream USB devices before damage can occur to the Pi, the PSU, your home's wiring, life, and limb. A sensible thing to do in my opinion.
For your soul's peace: there is an overload breaker in the socket where my PSU is plugged.
I'm not sure that the PCIe power is specifically reduced - it's just a side effect of a lack of power to the system overall.
That too. :lol: (First saw that poster near a college mainframe c1976, when I was learning Fortran. Seems it goes back two decades further than that.)ejolson wrote: ↑Tue Dec 03, 2024 7:09 pmI always thought that tingling was because "Das komputermaschine ist nicht für der gefingerpoken und mittengrabben."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blinkenlights
The Pi 4 PoE hat claims 802.3at and 4A at 5V suggesting 20W when the standard specifies 30W. I recall I used to drive one (on its own) with no problems from an af switch port. So I would guess everything needs to be chunked up a bit to reach 30W with a bit of margin for tolerance.bensimmo wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 8:40 amWhatever happened to the POE HAT+ (Pi5 Edition) ?
Here is all the design talk form October 2023, about 70 weeks ago, but as far as I remember it never appeared.
So either demand is not deemed there, or someone forgot about it, or getting a reliable and stable 5A is a problem.
(It was also missing from the Pi500 product but is on designed on the board so that may rule out demand)
https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/design ... etworking/ to refresh your memory. This is now quality 'Vapourware' ?
???mjlevey wrote: ↑Mon Apr 21, 2025 1:49 pmI have 2 raspberry pi 5's. ! has the Hailo AI kit. The 2nd has a PI camera attached. Icouldn't get the Hailo KIT to work with the camera as I was putting it into a metal case and it was shorting out. Why not use a 3D printed case. Coz I already bought a metal one. Why can't we use Docker with multiple resources to run our PI's. It keeps giving me errors. Either *** NO CAMERA DETECTED *** or no PCIE detected... You know what I'm talking about. Isn't this 2025. Aren't we on the brink of AI Humanoid robot and domination. Why is 1 tiny little thing holding us back? And for F%ck sakes.. stop showuing me foxes!!
Welcome, new user?bensimmo wrote: ↑Mon Apr 21, 2025 6:31 pm???mjlevey wrote: ↑Mon Apr 21, 2025 1:49 pmI have 2 raspberry pi 5's. ! has the Hailo AI kit. The 2nd has a PI camera attached. Icouldn't get the Hailo KIT to work with the camera as I was putting it into a metal case and it was shorting out. Why not use a 3D printed case. Coz I already bought a metal one. Why can't we use Docker with multiple resources to run our PI's. It keeps giving me errors. Either *** NO CAMERA DETECTED *** or no PCIE detected... You know what I'm talking about. Isn't this 2025. Aren't we on the brink of AI Humanoid robot and domination. Why is 1 tiny little thing holding us back? And for F%ck sakes.. stop showuing me foxes!!
Nice sharing, thanks. Will give it a try to see if it works.BrotherOrchid wrote: ↑Tue Apr 29, 2025 10:53 pmTip for Chromium users who watch Youtube videos. Go to the chrome://flags settings menu, and enable Vulkan as the graphics backend. There's a slight improvement with dropped frames for 1080p 60fps content.
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