[geeks] DVD install of MacOS 10.5.3 or 10.5.4

Mon Jul 28 23:35:22 CDT 2008

On 29 Jul 2008, at 01:03, Shannon Hendrix wrote:
>> I'm pretty damned sure there have been errors like the one 
>> mentioned below in plenty of Linux distro CDs. I can't cite 
>> examples, but I know Linux has always been far from perfect.
>> It's been many years since Solaris was released with filesystem 
> errors as severe as MacOS Leopard, and the last time it happened 
> they released updated versions.

I never mentioned Solaris, for that very reason!
> But you miss the point: Solaris and Linux provide the latest 
> versions of their install DVD in a nearly constant stream, so you 
> can boot updated code to fix things most any time.

Seeing as you were so insistent on citing the 'Average user' scenario 
when complaining about making a custom Mac OS X CD, then consider 
this. Average user, only PC is hosed, who the hell are they supposed 
to download an updated OS Install ISO for their box? They don't, they 
use the CD they used in the first place. Yes updated ISOs are 
available but only uber-geeks like us with 17 computers in one room 
and a coffee maker that plays Dixie (actually mine just sounds like 
the drum line from a death metal track, but hey) will actually have 
the facility and forward thinking to burn a new one ;)
> Can you name any time a supported Linux or Solaris release had a 
> severe bug that the company did not release an updated version for 
> repair and re-install?

Which part of 'I can't cite examples' did you fail to read. I'm not 
Steve Ballmer, I don't have a catalogue of every Linux failure in 
history in my desk drawer.
> For that matter, even Microsoft does that.

Name a place where, as a *consumer* (or for that matter a small 
business that doesn't use volume licensing), I can download a XP SP3 
install image. That facility is only available to enterprise & 
education customers AFAIK, the same enterprise & education customers 
that have access to the tools to roll their own OS X CDs.
> Apple is actually one of the few OS makers who don't keep updated 
> install images available.

So sue them, plenty of other people do.
> For that matter, they may be the only one in terms of mainstream OS.

Retail copies of OS X are updated every time a new series of computers 
requiring a later version of OS X are released, which is roughly on a 
4-6 monthly basis. I don't know if there has been such a release since 
Leopard however. Yes it's not an ideal thing, and no I'm not implying 
you re-buy OS X every time they update it BUT you could try asking 
your Apple store to exchange your copy if a newer version is 
available, or if you are an enterprise/education user you just ring up 
and ask for an updated version.
>> That said at least Apple's DVDs boot to the right GUI screen rs on 
>> most Macs, which is more than I can say for most Linux distros ;)
>> In what way is that relevant?

It was a joke, did you miss the smilie?
>>> The problem with Leopard is 10.5.0 has critical filesystem code 
>>> errors in it, and it is dangerous to use 10.5.0 to fix a system.
>>>> It's also dangerous to drive to work ;)
>> Key Lime Pie is also green.
>> How is either relevant?

As was that... which you also seemed to miss the smilie on.
Jeesh I go to these efforts to add light hearted japery to my e-mail, 
and make it clear I'm doing so using generally recognised symbology, 
and people still don't get it. I'm going back to writing my e-mails 
from the miserable old fart POV :P ;) :) <--- LOOK IT'S A JOKE!!!
>> Which errors would you be referring to? If it's the one I think you 
>> mean then it's not likely to ben an issue, but I may have missed 
>> something else you are referring to. I don't keep up with all the 
>> jazz on niggles like that, even though I probably should.
>> Apple fixed bugs after 10.5.0 where heavy drive I/O causes 
> filesystem failures, some of which can cause data loss.
>> It was particularly bad for people doing database work, running 
> VMware, or doing other heavy I/O, but could at times affect most 
> anyone.
>> So every time you boot your 10.5.0 DVD to repair a drive, you are 
> using their known broken OS code to run a very I/O heavy process.
>> There were also some core OS fixes for various issues, lot's of 
> memory leak issues, and the drive repair tools have been updated 
> since 10.5.0.

Well dang, yes I do remember that one. Good thing I clone my boot 
drive every 2-3 months. There are ways around it, it's not the end of 
the earth that the DVD doesn't work right. No, actually it is, you're 
right. For the record I've installed Leopard on 3 PowerPC and 1 Intel 
machine from the same 10.5.0 DVD and had zero file loss issues during 
the install. Not evidence of perfection, I'll grant you, but it at 
least proves that install do not implode on a highly regular basis due 
to the aforementioned bug. I haven't used the disk tools on a disk 
however, so I can't say if I've been personally effected by that part.
Also, I wonder how hard it would be for them to make Time Machine 
backups (which I also keep a running one of) bootable. They said they 
were going to be originally, but seemed to have conveniently missed 
that out. Oh well 10.6 is out early next year I guess we could hoe 
they put it in that seeing as it's supposed to be what Leopard was 
supposed to be when it was actually finished.
-- 
Mark Benson
My Blog:
<http://markbenson.org/blog>
Visit my Homepage: <http://homepage.mac.com/markbenson>
"Never send a human to do a machine's job..."