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Re: [ontolog-forum] NULLs and 3+1 vs. 4D ontologies (was Re: Knowledge g

from [Simon Spero] [Permanent Link][Original]
To: "[ontolog-forum]" <ontolog-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
From: Simon Spero <sesuncedu@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: 2013年1月22日 13:16:08 -0500
Message-id: <CADE8KM65hOSxibJjsT+_Zhgf3jZbZm8Ddq1RwyUbq_Ugtbnoew@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
On Tue, Jan 22, 2013 at 12:19 PM, Matthew West <dr.matthew.west@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Dear Simon,

 

An good example of this are Fictional people (in worlds in which they are fictional, not in their fictional worlds).  These entities have a temporal extent, but assigning them to a spacial location is problematic. 

 [...]

MW: I don’t see a problem. There simply is a possible world in which they do exist and have a location. You can’t place them in the “real” world simply because they do not exist there, and the one they do exist in can be arbitrarily similar to the real world that we are in and they are not.


This was the case I was trying to distinguish: 

(1) In our world, at some time prior to 1887, at 1 Bush Villas, Elm Grove, SouthSea, Portsmouth, England,  Arthur Conan Doyle conceived of the fictional character "Sherlock Holmes". 

(2)  Before 1887  the character "Sherlock Holmes" did not exist as something to which the conception of could be attributed.  

(3) In our world, the fictional character of Holmes was partially inspired by the actual person Joseph Bell, who was a Doctor. 

(4) In our world, the BBC commissioned a number of films featuring modern  reinterpretations of the Conan Doyle stories,  featuring a Holmes who in the worlds of those movies differed in some respects from the original source.  [Written by Stephen Moffat, who isn't a Doctor, but writes one on TV] 

(5) In the fictional world  in which our Conan Doyle conceived, Holmes was a detective, who resided at 221B Baker St. 

(6) In a  possible real world, that Conan Doyle may have conceived of a fictional world in which Holmes was a baker, who lived at 221B Detective St. 

(7) In yet another possible world, Bell may have been partially inspired by Conan Doyle to conceive of a Holmes and write fictional stories featuring that character word-for-word identical with the ones in our Conan Doyle wrote.  

Is the fictional character in (1) the same fictional character as in (4)? 
Is the fictional character in (5) the same fictional character as in (6)?
Is the fictional character in (1) the same fictional character as in (7)?

In our  world could two people in the year 1700 discuss  the character Sherlock Holmes?
In our world, could two people in 2013 discuss real properties of the character Sherlock Holmes (e.g. the street address where the character was conceived). 

Simon

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